Follow Sabrina here:

https://SabrinaSmelko.ca 
@SabrinaSmelko

https://Heelr.ca
@Heelr.ca

Transcription

Brandstorming with Sabrina Smelko

[00:00:00] Travis Bader: I'm Travis Bader, and this is the Silvercore podcast. Silvercore has been providing its members with the skills and knowledge necessary to be confident and proficient in the outdoors for over 20 years. And we make it easier for people to deepen their connection to the natural world. If you enjoy the positive and educational content.

[00:00:30] Travis Bader: We provide, please let others know by sharing, commenting, and following so that you can join in on everything that Silvercore stands for. If you'd like to learn more about becoming a member of the Silvercore club and community, visit our website at silvercore. ca.

[00:00:54] Travis Bader: You may have seen her as a host of HGTV's Save My Reno. She's an award winning illustrator. A designer who left the comfort and security of the corporate world to embark on an adventure closer to nature, closer to her heart. Now she helps others overcome their challenges to live their best lives.

[00:01:11] Travis Bader: Welcome to the Silvercore podcast, the equally creative and courageous Sabrina Smelko. 

[00:01:17] Sabrina Smelko: Hey, that's a very nice intro. Thank you very much for having me. 

[00:01:21] Travis Bader: Absolutely. You can tell I worked on that one, right? 

[00:01:25] Sabrina Smelko: Just a little bit, maybe me sending you my websites yesterday sporadically, like here's how to introduce me.

[00:01:31] Travis Bader: You know, you've got a pretty interesting life and you're doing things in a, uh, in a way that's extremely unique to yourself. Uh, you've helped out a lot with the Silver Core Outdoors brand and our, on our messaging and what we do. And I thought there's. A lot of value to others who are probably in the same position as yourself, working their way through life, trying to find what's going to bring them fulfillment, trying to find what that definition of success is for them.

[00:01:59] Travis Bader: And you've done some pretty cool things with your life. Like you've traveled around the world, giving talks to others. You help people bring their brands up from zero to a thousand and more. And. You do that with some formal training and a lot of chutzpah as well. So maybe we can just kind of rewind a little bit because there are some value points that I'd love to get through to the audience.

[00:02:28] Travis Bader: But I want to know about you, like, how is it that you found yourself in the high flying world of being in the public eye and sharing everything about your life, uh, to where you are now? 

[00:02:41] Sabrina Smelko: Yeah, that's been an interesting journey because I think anyone from the outside looking at my career trajectory, whatever you want to call it, you'd think I did it a little bit backwards.

[00:02:51] Sabrina Smelko: I'm in my thirties now, but I had a television show in my mid twenties that I left and quit. to now pursue my own business. And I feel like I'm back right where I was when I first graduated, but with a whole other framework and mentality and mindset for how I approach my work. So when I first began, I mean, just to kind of give you a little backstory of who I am.

[00:03:13] Sabrina Smelko: I mean, I graduated in 2012 with my bachelor's of applied arts. I went to art school, so four years of color theory and life. Drawing and learning textiles and pattern making, animation, website design, coding, all of that kind of stuff. Yeah. And I was always very much on the fringe of wanting to just do everything.

[00:03:32] Sabrina Smelko: I think a lot of people in my program were quite traditional illustrators. They knew they wanted to be children's book artists or just do spot illustrations for the New York Times forever. And I was like, yeah, I want to do all of that. But I also want to code sites and make a fashion line and have my own brands.

[00:03:48] Sabrina Smelko: And I, I was just constantly doing stuff. Even from a young age, I would like invent a jewelry company just because it like came into my mind that day. And at night I'd run into my parents bedroom being like, how do I start a pet motel? How do people know how to find me? Like, how does a phone book work? I was just really curious about, I wanted to run businesses.

[00:04:06] Sabrina Smelko: I wanted to do things and make things real. And I think. When I graduated, I realized when I went into advertising, as opposed to illustration, it's because I've, I've always been about ideas and brands, but I didn't know what that was back then. Branding wasn't even really a word like branding yourself as an individual or as an influencer or.

[00:04:27] Sabrina Smelko: Launching your own business was not super common. There's the big brands that were marketed to you in the magazines and then you as a freelancer or a little independent artist. And I didn't really know that there was a place for helping people be their own brand. And so in the process of me just learning and experimenting and I quit advertising because the whole 9 to 5 wasn't working for me and freelance doing all kinds of creative stuff.

[00:04:53] Sabrina Smelko: And I think by just doing so many offshoots, I developed my own brand without really realizing it, of just being a curious kind of girl who was really into art, really into design. And then as I grew up on social media, when Instagram came out in 2012, I was one of the first adopters, shared my life, shared my home renovations.

[00:05:12] Sabrina Smelko: I bought my first home quite young, shared that whole process. And so I was just making things and I was kind of being a creator or an influencer without really knowing it, but I didn't really know myself. And so when I got this television show at 25 years old, I was right in the midst of figuring out who I was and experimenting, doing all these things, but not really being an expert in any one.

[00:05:36] Sabrina Smelko: And then I got this television show, which landed me as. A television designer. And now 

[00:05:41] Travis Bader: you're the expert, right? In everyone's eyes, you're the expert. 

[00:05:45] Sabrina Smelko: Exactly. And I found that extremely uncomfortable. Did 

[00:05:49] Travis Bader: you feel like an expert when you were up there or did you 

[00:05:52] Sabrina Smelko: feel like you're faking it? I felt like such a fraud and the biggest thing that bugged me about it was exactly the fact that there was other people creating and contributing to the show and it's not shown that way, right?

[00:06:05] Sabrina Smelko: I'm kind of the end all be all designer, but that wasn't the truth. The truth is we have interior designers on almost every single television show you've seen. And... I wanted to just be more authentic about that process and how that works, but in all of my experimenting and doing all these things, I feel like that's what got me the show.

[00:06:24] Sabrina Smelko: And then once I had the show, it, the show snuffed out all of that experimentation I was doing. And I just really felt unfulfilled. I felt like everything. stopped. I was offshooting doing a million things and then out of nowhere it was just, you have no more time, all of it's taken up doing this show, you'll be compensated for it.

[00:06:43] Sabrina Smelko: Obviously the money is the benefit to the time that they take from you, but I learned the hard way that my time was more valuable. Money meant nothing to me when My days felt like I was trapped in someone else's narrative of what I was and who I was, and the emails and the friends and the, the connections that I made out of that didn't feel authentic to me because people would contact me to say, Hey, I have ten grand, can you renovate my house?

[00:07:11] Sabrina Smelko: The premise of the show was saving money and getting the homeowners involved in the reno. So I was just like a cheap renovation design expert and A, I'm not an interior designer. I love it. I think you can call yourself an interior designer without going to school and all of that. But it was something I dabbled in and I never wanted to call myself an expert in it.

[00:07:32] Sabrina Smelko: And here I found myself kind of pigeonholed at a young age and people looking at me across the world thinking of me as this interior design. Expert who can take your 10 grand and make it look like a hundred thousand dollars. And it just felt very 

[00:07:47] uncomfortable. 

[00:07:48] Travis Bader: Well, you had a few seasons and you're green lit for another season.

[00:07:54] Travis Bader: And you said, no, and you walked away. What brought you to that precipice? What brought you to that self realization at a young age? That money wasn't the motivating factor for you. And it was something else. 

[00:08:08] Sabrina Smelko: It was time off the first time off I had ever had in my, honestly, my whole life. I grew up doing karate, dance, plays, acting, singing, everything that you can imagine.

[00:08:19] Sabrina Smelko: And I love it. I still, to this day, love performing, but it was the first time in my life between seasons where I had four months off with nothing to do essentially, because before, if I had four months off as a freelancer. Well, I'm drumming up business, I'm redoing my website, I'm inventing projects, if none are actually coming to me that are paid projects, I'm making up my own things.

[00:08:43] Sabrina Smelko: And it was the first time in my life where I didn't need the money or the recognition or I didn't need to work in that four months. I was literally off. It was the first time in my adult life that I sat down with myself and looked at my life and I owned a home in the GTA. I had a successful television show.

[00:09:01] Sabrina Smelko: I was engaged to be married. And I was. extremely unhappy. I was so unfulfilled in my work. I felt unfulfilled in my personal life. I wasn't happy with who I was with. And it was the first time that I was confronted with all of that. And it just slapped me all in the face and I couldn't distract myself with work.

[00:09:19] Sabrina Smelko: I couldn't distract myself driving to set or being in traffic or blaming it on something else. I had nothing to blame my unhappiness on because everything had been provided for me. I have a roof over my head. I have everything on paper that I could want and I'm miserable. And at the same token, I also was dealing with health issues, which I totally now believe are related my unhappiness and getting a diagnosis of a thyroid autoimmune condition, which is the center of your voice, which I don't find ironic at all that here I was not feeling authentic or feeling like I had a voice, even though I had a platform and that's where this health condition starts for me.

[00:09:59] Travis Bader: How old were you when that happened? 

[00:10:01] Sabrina Smelko: I was 25, 26. 

[00:10:03] Travis Bader: So you're basically having a midlife crisis at 25. 

[00:10:07] Sabrina Smelko: Yes, that's exactly what it felt like. And I didn't know who to turn to because my life was built up and I had been with my partner for nine years at that point. So our, our families were intertwined. Our lives were intertwined.

[00:10:21] Sabrina Smelko: I didn't feel safe. Even saying out loud that I wasn't happy because I felt like everyone, even in, in my personal life would look at me and go, what are you talking about? You have everything you could want. What more is 

[00:10:34] Travis Bader: there? You have all the trappings of success from an external vantage point.

[00:10:38] Travis Bader: Everybody else looking in would say, Hey, she's got it all. Isn't that funny? How many people will sit and look at the other side of the fence and then say, man, if only. If only I had what they had, if only I had this amount of money, if only I lived in this location, if only, if only, if only just to realize that we're all going through the same stuff and that our own personal quest for happiness, which is an oxymoron in itself, people searching for that level of happiness would presuppose you're already unhappy and happiness is not something that you can really find, but it's, I guess for me, anyways, it's a state of mind that you have to accept.

[00:11:18] Travis Bader: The process, the building, the creating, that's, that's what happiness is for me. What is it for you? 

[00:11:25] Sabrina Smelko: For me, it's a feeling that's the, that's the first and only word that honestly comes to mind, because I think my whole life up until that moment, I had ignored how I felt. And it's a physical thing. You know how you feel.

[00:11:40] Sabrina Smelko: And I was always trying to control that. And I was never just letting my feelings tell me the information they were trying to tell me. I was always trying to overcome them. And I think in part that had to do a little bit with my upbringing. I was in karate for 10 years and discipline was a huge part of karate and any kind of martial arts like that.

[00:12:03] Sabrina Smelko: And I... I feel like in many ways, obviously, that did so much for me mentally to learn that I could persevere and I can overcome things and I can have this kind of stoicism in my life. Mm. But I think, because I was so young when I was learning all of that, and I was a young girl, and growing up with Seventeen Magazine in that era, I kind of turned it a little bit more onto myself, and made it more about physical control, and you have to look a certain way, rather than feel a certain way.

[00:12:32] Sabrina Smelko: So for me now, happiness is feeling. It doesn't look like anything, it's how I feel in the moment. That could look like me sitting in my basement. Or it could look like being on top of a beautiful balcony somewhere in a tropical environment. Right. It's, it's, it's really how you feel. It's not something that you can quantify by any other thing than 

[00:12:51] Travis Bader: feeling.

[00:12:53] Travis Bader: So men and women will approach this differently. Men will have, they call it like gut feelings, right? Women will have women's intuition, how we can kind of feel these different things. I mean, I don't think I'm speaking out of pocket here to say that women are generally more in tune with their feelings and emotions than perhaps a man might be.

[00:13:12] Travis Bader: I know stoicism is a very hot topic nowadays and, uh, I don't know much about stoicism, but it seems to be a lot of just realizing, Hey, we're going to die, uh, reduce that ego, have a level of control. Uh, I don't think it delves too much into feelings. Does it, do you know much about stoicism? I saw the books on your, uh, on your bookshelf there, but 

[00:13:36] Sabrina Smelko: I mean, just not from necessarily reading, but just from life experience.

[00:13:41] Sabrina Smelko: Okay. For me, it's. And I, I have one tattoo and it's a little white flag, my little surrender flag. Yes. Cause to me, that's, that's what stoicism is. It's surrendering to what is. It's allowing, it's allowing life to happen while, control is a funny word, but while maintaining the idea that you have control over your energy, or at least where you spend it, who you spend it on and with, and where you bring that, and I do find it.

[00:14:16] Sabrina Smelko: It very empowering to think of the fact that life isn't just happening necessarily to you. I find it enjoyable and empowering to think that everywhere that I go, I'm influencing the energy with my energy. And in that way, I can control my outcome slightly while still being open to the ebb and flow of life.

[00:14:35] Sabrina Smelko: It's it's, I don't know if that's the proper definition by any means. That's just how I interpret 

[00:14:40] Travis Bader: it. So sort of like manifest destiny, you'll create your destiny. Sort of a matrix approach of being able to, uh, understand the systems and processes that work and you're essentially creating your own surrounding around you.

[00:14:54] Travis Bader: Is that something you would describe? 

[00:14:56] Sabrina Smelko: I do believe that. Absolutely. I totally am one of those energy people who, I think everything is energy and vibration and you can. shift it. I don't know how to explain it. I don't know how to get it through minds of people who are very closed off to that idea. I have experienced what I feel like are two different lives, perhaps three, but definitely in my youth.

[00:15:20] Sabrina Smelko: I was extremely depressed and I don't know that I want to use the word suicidal by any means, but I was very apathetic about life. I didn't care. And in that kind of a way you could almost be like, well, there's a certain amount of surrender in that you're just like, Oh, take me, whatever. If tomorrow I wither away, so be it.

[00:15:40] Sabrina Smelko: But now I embody a surrender in a powerful sense.

[00:15:50] Sabrina Smelko: In a funny way, I think I'm almost invincible like I might live forever And I think there's something to that that when you think and believe that way You're not so privy to the, ah, so be it. What if a car hits me tomorrow? it gives you a little bit more of a sense of you do have a purpose and Everything that's surrendering around you It's almost this beautiful relationship where you're the only one giving energy and you can almost see other people as not pawns in your life by any means.

[00:16:20] Sabrina Smelko: There's obviously so much importance to relationship, but I do think that we are on a very individual journey and a lot of it is energetic and very hard to explain. But all I know is I've come from two very different, my, my youth mind and where I am now is a completely different brain. It feels 

[00:16:40] Travis Bader: like. Do you have an example of any time when that energy feeling really became self evident to you?

[00:16:48] Sabrina Smelko: Probably throughout that, that summer that I was just referencing where I was off for the first time in my life, feeling the shift of relief when you make a decision that's right for you and that energetic 180 that happens just by making a decision. And so in that summer, one of the biggest decisions I hadn't yet decided I wanted to move across the country and quit my show and do all these more drastic things.

[00:17:14] Sabrina Smelko: For me, it was a lot closer to home. It was just in my relationship at the time. I went through a breakup as, as you know, all of these things came up. I naturally brought them to my partner and the process of breaking up began. And that single decision, the energetic shift of, I was in the same home, I'm in the same place, I still have the same job, but how I felt from the hour before I had that conversation to a minute later is such a shift that you, that's all that you can describe as life is, is a feeling and this energy shift.

[00:17:48] Sabrina Smelko: And I 

[00:17:50] Travis Bader: don't know. Do you find that? So. Maybe I'll tangent here and I'll ask a couple of questions. I know we kind of discussed in the past about ADHD. Is that something you've ever been accused of having? 

[00:18:01] Sabrina Smelko: By myself, by my own accord, for sure. And maybe my parents. 

[00:18:05] Travis Bader: So all these different ideas, all these different places that you could be working towards, um, uh, different businesses that you want to try and start.

[00:18:15] Travis Bader: Each one of these will bring a certain level of energy shift. It will bring a certain level of excitement as you endeavor on it. But at some point I would imagine as you start going down that route, it becomes mundane and it's time to shift again. As you talk about these energy shifts, is there perhaps a bit of a high associated with that shakeup that people might look at, look for, or is.

[00:18:40] Travis Bader: When you find your right energy, have you found that to sustain for you that you don't need to keep changing it? That's a 

[00:18:46] Sabrina Smelko: very interesting question for me personally. And I don't know, I'm not sure if it's personal or not, but it's fun, has a lot to do with it. If I'm having fun in my work day and my walk with my dog and my dinner with my partner, My energy shifts will be a little bit more frequent and positive.

[00:19:09] Sabrina Smelko: I find if I'm, if I think about when I was younger and I just didn't have any determination to do anything and just kind of went through the day, there's no excitement, so your energy's just constantly at this sort of like, if you think of like a frequency or us as, You know, like an actual scale of sound, you know, I feel like we're supposed to be like this constantly moving, growing, learning up and down balance.

[00:19:38] Sabrina Smelko: But I was just at such a flatline state. And I think a lot of people who are in that. That trap of just not living according to what makes them happy and caring too much about what others think perhaps, and that was definitely my trap. I think that's, that flatlines your energy. Your life force is just totally flatlined when you're not happy and you're not having fun.

[00:19:59] Sabrina Smelko: And for me, Having fun, beauty, happiness, those are the only things that bring me joy. And relate that to anything that can, for food, for art, for the shows I'm watching. I feel like the goal to feeling vibrant and living in a way that makes you happy and enjoying your job and enjoying your partnership is It's having fun.

[00:20:19] Sabrina Smelko: I feel like that's the point of life, honestly. If you're not having fun, and it sounds so simple, if you're not having fun, what's the point? But it's deeper than that for me, where I think that when you're in a fun energy state, your frequencies are going all over the place and you get to tap into whatever else is at that frequency.

[00:20:39] Sabrina Smelko: And the other fun things that exist at that high level, as opposed to being in that flatline state, you're only going to access flatline people, flatline feelings. I do believe that when you get happier and you increase your frequency, now you're going to interact with people of that frequency. If you're super happy one day and everything's, you know, buzzing and all of your ideas are good and you're having fun, I think you're going to attract people at that frequency and experiences at that frequency.

[00:21:02] Sabrina Smelko: And I, that's totally 

[00:21:04] Travis Bader: my belief. You know, I saw a good friend of mine. And he. Another ADHD fellow, undiagnosed, but he's got a way worse than I do. Like he'll be telling a story and then he's running through our house, arms waving everywhere as he's telling the story and looking behind him, like people are chasing him.

[00:21:21] Travis Bader: It's like. I wonder if this is what I look like sometimes, but I'm noticing it now anyways, he'll get into different things and he'll go all in. I've seen them make millions. I've seen them lose millions. I've seen them use, use on the uptick and figured out the formula for sustaining both his happiness and life and success in business right now, but you know, he'd get into things.

[00:21:42] Travis Bader: He'd get. Into radio and he'd collect radios. He's like, look at how cool this is. Right? All these old radios I'm rebuilding. And you take this crystal, it's just a crystal, right? And these crystals resonate on a frequency and you got to swap one crystal out for another crystal in order to talk on a different frequency or receive on a frequency.

[00:21:59] Travis Bader: And he says. Everything we do in life, we talk on a frequency, we see on a frequency, we, everything is working in wavelengths. And so he, he was a big believer in this from his, a more analytical scientific perspective. And then John Sinai gets, uh, he's been on the podcast in the past. He's a South African individual.

[00:22:22] Travis Bader: Um, I think it was in Dubai when I was talking with them and he was saying similar to what you're saying, you know, Um, how many, how many drug dealers and arsonists and, uh, criminals do, you know, well, I don't, right. This is like, do you think that there's none of them around you right now? Cause I'm willing to bet you go on a few block radius and you're going to find.

[00:22:42] Travis Bader: Some of these people probably in your life or around you, but how come it is that you don't see them because you're working on a different frequency and you're associating with people who are on your level. And if we understand this and we don't like the frequency that we're on, and we don't like the level that we're on a deep understanding of that would say to a person, logically.

[00:23:06] Travis Bader: There's something I should be able to do to change that. So I can maybe start hanging around with people who are bringing in more positivity, who encouraged the best in me, who are more productive and, uh, allowing me to be me and by default, a higher level of happiness. But I think, I think a lot of people have a fear of that change.

[00:23:30] Travis Bader: They're resistant. They. Do what they do. Cause that's what they've always done. And they end up getting the same thing over and over again. I get the sense. And in your intro, I mean. The equally creative and courageous Sabrina Smelko that there's a level of courage associated with making these changes.

[00:23:51] Travis Bader: Cause I think so many people go through life and they're like, I'm not happy. I can identify certain things in my life that I think would be better, but I can definitely identify what I, what I don't like, but man, if I made that change, there's this great big question mark in front of me. Do you feel that?

[00:24:08] Travis Bader: And if so, how do you deal with that? 

[00:24:11] Sabrina Smelko: Yes, definitely feel that. And how I deal with it is I think I'm a very positive person where I totally believe that that next thing is a twofold a, it's going to be better, but be it because of me, I think that by choosing something different and making that change. I don't believe in subscribing to like, okay, I ended this relationship, I'm making this change, I'm just gonna wait.

[00:24:38] Sabrina Smelko: And I think a lot of people in this space talk about, well, if it's for me, it'll just come to me. But I think you have to use your energy to get the thing that you want. And so, even if it's just intention, even if it's just mental thought and focus on that next thing, I just have always had faith that so long as I know what I want and I'm constantly learning what I want and learning myself, that next thing will always be better.

[00:25:02] Sabrina Smelko: That next thing will always be for me because I'm evolving and I'm learning more and in my experience, I'm happier now than I was. Five years ago, 10 years ago, 20 years ago. So I, I have trust. I think trust is huge in the game of life. If you don't trust yourself, if you don't trust your life, if you don't trust that what's meant for you is happening and that maybe even the challenges you're going through are meant to happen, you're never going to get anything.

[00:25:31] Sabrina Smelko: Because I think you have to, trust requires courage and it also requires this lack of fear where you just blindly go at it because you trust that there's something better. So if you don't have trust, You're never going to do anything courageous. 

[00:25:45] Travis Bader: So somebody from a religious background would say, uh, have a belief in the wise dispensation of divine providence, right?

[00:25:53] Travis Bader: Belief and there's an external thing out there that I can, I can trust. Some of the things that you're talking about, stoicism would also lay into, uh, Taoism, right? Into the idea of surrender and. I understand being in the now or the way, right. Which I think is what Dow means is the way. Um, but this trust has to come from somewhere for you.

[00:26:18] Travis Bader: Where does that trust come from? Is it something that you've built over time and you look at repeatable actions and say, I can trust this because I've seen it in the past. And if that's the case, how do you take that next step that you haven't seen? Or does it come from something else external? 

[00:26:34] Sabrina Smelko: That's a great question because I think the answer is kind of even surprising to me, which is that.

[00:26:40] Sabrina Smelko: I learned that I couldn't trust anyone else is the best answer I can give. My, I was a very good girl my whole life and in quotations, good girl. I did everything everyone told me to. Any rules there were always just followed. It doesn't mean I didn't question them, but I think. What happened for me was that I went along with everyone else's path, get married, have kids, do this, be successful, buy a house at this age, whatever.

[00:27:08] Sabrina Smelko: And obviously none of it satisfied me. And so I stopped trusting anyone but myself. I think at that time, I actually, as a. I made a huge poster that said, trust no one. I love it. And, and I, I, I wish I could revise it to trust yourself. Maybe it would seem a little bit more positive, but I, I think that was a huge realization for me at the time was that.

[00:27:32] Sabrina Smelko: I only ever got anything I wanted out of life when I trusted myself, even when other people fought that. Even when my parents or people close to me would question things. If I ever did it myself, it was a good outcome. When I did it for someone else... And for someone else's narrative or story, I, I'd never loved the outcome.

[00:27:53] Sabrina Smelko: And so I think through trial and error of my own life, over many different relationships, doing a play, taking this course, you know, I realized that when I was following others or trusting what they told me to do and what, you know, this might make you happy, this will keep you safe. I didn't like any of the results.

[00:28:14] Sabrina Smelko: And it was only once I realized enough times of... Every time I did my own thing, I was really happy about it. And so it was just self trust and to, I will must say to, there was also, um, as I was referring to earlier, kind of like a darker time in my youth that I did go through some hard stuff and I was the only one who pulled myself out.

[00:28:33] Sabrina Smelko: I never talked about it with anybody. I never even shared with my parents, all of the deep, hard issues that I was going through. I got myself out of that time. And I think, 

[00:28:45] Travis Bader: why wouldn't you share with others? Not that I'm judging, because I would be the same way. 

[00:28:50] Sabrina Smelko: Yeah, I just didn't feel safe. I felt that every time I shared something negative or even just like a Untrue belief it was like what are you talking about?

[00:29:02] Sabrina Smelko: I just didn't feel safe necessarily sharing I felt like the reaction was almost as bad as the feeling itself. I wasn't I didn't get comfort necessarily when I shared Friends, family, whoever it may have been with. I didn't get what I needed out of 

[00:29:17] Travis Bader: sharing. I find that interesting. I find so many times people will, will share something and the other person will want to provide solutions or maybe diminish it.

[00:29:29] Travis Bader: You're sad. Think of these other people. You're hungry. Well, you don't know starvation. You're whatever it might be. And they're trying to create that balance in your head for you. I'll be at well meaning sure. Perhaps 

[00:29:41] Sabrina Smelko: I find too, especially when it's hard stuff, people are uncomfortable who are close to you because they love you.

[00:29:47] Sabrina Smelko: They want to just help by providing, well, here's what you could have done instead. Maybe if you didn't do this, maybe if you did the debt and it was a lot of what ifs and a lot of. hypothetical in a lot of hindsight, and I just don't find that helpful, personally. I'm very much, I mean, maybe it's my ADHD run before I walk personality, but I want to know moving forward how to avoid this.

[00:30:07] Sabrina Smelko: I don't want to know why I got into this mess. I know why I'm here. I understand mentally I'm in this place. I don't need to, Look back at how I got here. I want to get out and it wasn't progressive solutions necessarily when I would share It was more like well, how did how did this happen? And I wasn't wanting to dwell in that place So at around 17 18, I had to just decide mentally for myself like I this is something I need to overcome myself This is something and eventually I would share with people and eventually, you know People close to me and my partner helped me through a lot of that.

[00:30:40] Sabrina Smelko: But yeah, it was It's that self trust, self faith, self work, that really got me through and that leads me to still make courageous decisions because I'm like, hey, if I got through that stuff alone and every time I do something on my own volition, it leads to good things. Frick, I'm going to trust myself, you know.

[00:31:02] Travis Bader: You know, I, I got a hypothesis and I could be completely wrong, but, um, or I could be completely right that people will tend to diminish somebody's honest feelings that are being shared with them, either through a leveling process, through, Of look at how bad it, it could be somewhere else. You should feel fine or dismissing the person's concepts or ideas because they're not honest with themselves.

[00:31:27] Travis Bader: And there's a fear in themselves of being able to share that what you're feeling is absolutely normal. And we always have these ideas in society of trying to get to a normal place of trying to feel happy of trying to be how normal should be. And however you are feeling is very likely, very normal for how.

[00:31:51] Travis Bader: You should be at that point of what you're going through of similar life experiences of similar impulse and input, uh, it's normal. And if you don't like that normal place where you're in right now, just know that it's normal for you to be able to get out of there too. 

[00:32:07] Sabrina Smelko: Yes. That would have been very helpful.

[00:32:10] Sabrina Smelko: And that's something I've now learned. And anytime someone has a hardship or if they need to chat about it, I find that's the most helpful thing is just. That's okay. So what? I know you're feeling this way. Yeah, I have before too. It changes every every there's nothing permanent It will always change and I felt like when I shared any negative emotions like that exactly to your point.

[00:32:32] Sabrina Smelko: It was just like Devastating where this is the rest of your life Oh my goodness, like but it could I what I was really just wanting and looking for what I now know is just okay Like I hear that you feel that way like let's It's not trying to figure out why. It doesn't have to be deciphered. It's just acknowledging a feeling and that is, it can pass and that you can shift it.

[00:32:55] Sabrina Smelko: You can shift that energy and that's why I had to learn that on my own was how to change my mood, how to change my mind, how to shift, how the heck do you shift your own energy when you're in that kind of a funk? But I think just knowing that, that knowledge that it does change and if you just accept it, if you just let yourself go through that emotion, get the angriest you'll ever get.

[00:33:15] Sabrina Smelko: Get the most depressed you'll ever get. Allow yourself to feel sad, and guess what? Tomorrow you'll probably see something and laugh and go, Oh wow, okay, so I can simultaneously feel sad and laugh at something, and that's okay. That's life. I just wanted it to be okay to have a full spectrum of emotions, and I felt like up until that moment of my life, everything was positive.

[00:33:34] Sabrina Smelko: I had such a beautiful, charmed childhood and life, and nothing bad ever happened, and Once I reached that 13 14 year old state when you start seeing things in the world and maybe friends go through hard times and you see loss for the first time, I just didn't know that that was okay. That that could coexist with.

[00:33:52] Sabrina Smelko: Being happy and having a nice meal the next day, you know, it was never that emotional side of things It's not taught to you. You don't learn it in school and unless your parents are extreme feelers and Emotional themselves and willing to let all of that down, which is hard to ask of a lot of people Sure, sure.

[00:34:10] Sabrina Smelko: It's tough for a kid who feels a lot to Learn that maybe certain feelings are bad or to hide them. And so I learned for a long time to, to hide my feelings. And I think back to now quitting my show and getting my autoimmune thyroid disorder. I think for so long, I was just suppressing certain feelings. I was suppressing any time I felt negative in my relationship that I didn't want to be in.

[00:34:33] Sabrina Smelko: How, how did I do that for so many years? It was just a suppression of feeling. 

[00:34:40] Travis Bader: I do believe that what we're thinking about and our feelings that we have will manifest themselves physically. I'm, I do ascribe to that a hundred percent. Um, you know, there's a couple of sayings that we kind of tossed around in our house.

[00:34:53] Travis Bader: Uh, once there is no tiger, I think, uh, we may have talked about this one before. There is no tiger. And that was a excellent storyteller, a guy who's got a YouTube channel and TikTok and all the rest. But he talks about, um, just bombing one day right in front of his boss on a road trip, on a sales call, and it was supposed to be big and he just bombed it and he's feeling terrible.

[00:35:16] Travis Bader: And he goes into the hotel bar later at night and orders himself a drink and woman jumps over the bar and get someone together. Turns out it wasn't even the bartender, he says, but, uh, she had a tattoo. Really? A gruff, um, hard Polish woman, he says, looks like she could have led some labor revolts herself single handedly.

[00:35:38] Travis Bader: And she's got a tattoo on her arm at a time when tattoos weren't popular. And he asked, what is that? And he says, there is no tiger. He's like, well, what does that mean? It says, you know, in time we had real concerns. We would be eaten by bears. We'd fall through the ice. It'd be eaten by a tiger. Now. There is no tiger.

[00:35:56] Travis Bader: So when we're feeling bad or feeling overwhelmed and having that, there is no tiger sort of mantra. Okay. Yeah. What's the worst that could happen? Let's play this one too, too. Like what you're saying, feel bad, go through to the next logical step. What's the worst that could happen if we go through this?

[00:36:15] Travis Bader: There is no tiger. And the other one is anyone can sail a boat. A friend of mine went out and he had a sailboat. He picked up and I was like, I didn't know he could sail. He's like, wait, talking about it's big sheet. That's a win. Anyone can sail a boat, right? So he's out there sailing a boat. I'm like. I like that.

[00:36:34] Travis Bader: He said, sure, there's going to be a lot to it. If you want to be really proficient and good at it, but I mean, maybe you suck, but you're still catching the wind and sailing your boat. Anyone can sail a boat. And when I look at things that like what you're talking about before, maybe the imposter syndrome, like who am I to go out and do this?

[00:36:51] Travis Bader: Who am I to stand in front of a group and lecture on, on, on this topic when my background is a, and I'm talking about B. Um, but anyone can sail a boat and the more we do it, the more comfortable we'll get at it and the better we'll be. And if we just keep that mentality in our head, it's amazing what we can accomplish.

[00:37:11] Sabrina Smelko: Yeah. And the resiliency that that builds, like your tenacity, you, that's just something that a lot of people don't develop in their life is the ability to just kind of bounce back or try things and learn things and stay in that kid, like energy. Like, I think that's. So important. That's, you know, what might lead to an early death is stopping.

[00:37:29] Sabrina Smelko: Just stop learning and stop doing things and be like, I've done everything I've needed to do. Like, I never want to be that way. I think that's the key to a long, happy, healthy life is constantly just learning new things. Go on adventures, treat your life like an adventure. It's so short. I think about that all the time.

[00:37:46] Sabrina Smelko: It could be taken away tomorrow. Like, I don't know. I just have a whole, yep. Memento Mori. Absolutely. 

[00:37:52] Travis Bader: You know, that's number one fear for a lot of people. Well, I guess number one fear is supposed to be public speaking. And then, you know, the fear of death. And I remember I've done this with my wife in the past and we're in an airplane hopping between little islands and it's extremely turbulent and it's bumping around and she's not feeling good because at one point she really didn't like flying.

[00:38:18] Travis Bader: Now, I think she's kind of got her head wrapped around it. And, uh, I look at her, I'm like, you know, what helps me sometimes is I think of like, what's the worst possible scenario that could happen right now. And she's like, well, I guess we could crash and die. I'm like, no, no, no. That's not the worst possible scenario.

[00:38:32] Travis Bader: Right. I mean, we could crash and be horribly injured and be out in the ocean and sharks are swimming around and we've been in a lot of pain for an extended period of time. And, but that's not happening right now. It's just a little bumpy, isn't it? Right. And I don't think in the moment that sort of, uh, pep talk helped her.

[00:38:51] Travis Bader: But she has mentioned later on that she utilizes that principle when looking at things. And it's a helpful principle, uh, that, and the other one, I know she was, I think at the time, uh, it was amazing, the right hat, the right person has to be able to, uh, be able to accept this information, giving birth to her first child, extended long labor.

[00:39:16] Travis Bader: And I said, you know, obviously lots of emotion, lots of pain, lots of. Everything. And I said, you know, this is one day of your life. How do you want to look back on it? Right. And, uh, she says that really helped her that that different mind shift. And cause you know, she looks up to her grandmother, who was a very tough woman and who's, uh, endured a lot of hardship and pain.

[00:39:39] Travis Bader: And I mean, how we act at our worst times is really what defines us and what builds that character within us, as opposed to how we act when things are bad. Going well and how we present ourselves when everything's perfect. 

[00:39:53] Sabrina Smelko: Absolutely. And it builds right? Like every time you go through one of those things where you overcome a fear or you're not so afraid of something, or you can do something with a little less.

[00:40:03] Sabrina Smelko: about it, that like build something in you that I think is so vital. And now in my life, I'm very much focused on that. Before I was a little bit more in my head and I've always been into yoga and more of like that mental health side of things. But I think as I get older, I'm really interested in like the physical again and maintaining.

[00:40:27] Sabrina Smelko: That resiliency on more of like a physical side of things and being sure that I, I am able and mobile and can continue because I know how much I get out of when I do things like that and put myself out there and move to a new place. I grow so much and you get so much confidence and that's when you get into your adulthood and you're like, ah, like the thirties are better than your twenties, you know, and I'm sure in your forties, you're like forties are better than your thirties because you learn yourself more and you develop your.

[00:40:57] Sabrina Smelko: Your character, like you were saying. And so, yeah, at this point in my life, I'm trying a little bit more to. Bring that back into balance and, and listening to the podcast too, like building muscle and physically training again and wanting to kind of get back into martial arts a little bit. And it's all such a balance, like the energy stuff and the physical stuff.

[00:41:16] Sabrina Smelko: It's, you start to just realize if it's not in a perfect balance for you individually, you're just, it's all about feeling, as I said before. So if something's off, you're just not going to feel good. And so, Right now, I'm back to working at home and for myself and getting into that routine where I don't want to necessarily work out.

[00:41:36] Sabrina Smelko: It's kind of annoying to, you know, get sweaty or go for a run, but I'm really trying to build those things back into my life because I feel like I've overcome a lot of mental hard things and now I really want to continue challenging myself to not be Not be content, because it's easy to sit here and just work from home all day and be inside and sit on my butt.

[00:41:54] Sabrina Smelko: But I'm really trying to continue to push myself now that I am happy and fulfilled in my life. To not just stay here because, as I've learned, I am happy and fulfilled because I'm constantly seeking, learning, and exploring. And I'm happy right now because... I've made some of those changes and I'm in a better place, but I'm still happy because I'm still doing these things.

[00:42:19] Sabrina Smelko: Currently our house is for sale and we're thinking about up and moving totally somewhere random that we've never even been. We're looking at New Zealand or the islands and Sunshine Coast. So we don't know. I'm just, I think that you have to maintain fun in your life to feel fulfilled and to build your character and to stay happy.

[00:42:38] Sabrina Smelko: You 

[00:42:38] Travis Bader: know, you're talking about the, uh, the physical side of thing and spending so much time on the mental side, it's amazing how much physicality will affect the mental outlook. And it is such a vicious cycle though, because when your head's not in the right place, trying to get physical. Man, is that tough?

[00:42:55] Travis Bader: Like even just getting the motivation to go up for a run or a walk or get out and do something can be difficult. And I can recall many a hike in the mountains when I'm flying up the mountain and just on top of my game and just heavy pack on, and I don't even feel it. And I can also recall many a hike in the mountain where I'm slogging and every step is just a burden as I'm going up and it was just through just sheer grit, determination, and tenacity of just pig headed stubbornness that I get to where I need to get to, but man, it's tough.

[00:43:29] Travis Bader: And the only difference wasn't necessarily my physical health because my physical health was more or less the same, but it was definitely the mental. Outlook on life. And now you deal with people, uh, helping them get their voice, be able to, uh, promote themselves out in the digital world through websites or through social media.

[00:43:55] Travis Bader: What are some of the. Biggest challenges that you see people are having in order to get themselves out. And what are some of your like top 10 tips to be able to overcome that? 

[00:44:07] Sabrina Smelko: The biggest thing, repeat, I see with nearly every client is that imposter syndrome. Almost everyone I speak to doesn't feel like they're slightly embarrassed when they contact me that they want to have a brand and that they think that they should.

[00:44:22] Sabrina Smelko: And almost everyone I talked to, it was. Last week. I can recall this like it was yesterday. This girl went on to be like, hi, I'm really excited to launch my own brand. However, I shouldn't be doing this. I know nothing. I feel like an imposter. And then she described for five minutes, all of her legitimate.

[00:44:43] Sabrina Smelko: Experience all of the things that led her to this point, everything in her personal life, her childhood, her education, her last couple of jobs that she had made it so perfect for what she was trying to launch. And what's really interesting to me is I've started to realize that imposter syndrome is almost just feeling like you've never done that thing before, while knowing that you're meant for it.

[00:45:08] Sabrina Smelko: And I think that's where it comes from, because it's like, it feels right, you know that it, it's like a costume that feels comfortable to put on, but you've never put it on before, no one told you to put it on, and, and no book did it tell you to put it on. And I think that's where imposter syndrome comes from, is when something feels so right to you.

[00:45:25] Sabrina Smelko: But no one else has done it, and no one's told you to do it. And I think that if you feel imposter syndrome, that might be the best sign that you're on the right track. Because you feel like an imposter in your own self. You haven't even told anyone about this. You just feel like a fake because you've never done it before.

[00:45:42] Sabrina Smelko: But it's your next level that you need to get to. So, just try and get comfortable with that fact that this is for you. And I think... We, we call it imposter syndrome, but it should just be called discomfort before you grow into that next stage that you're supposed to be at, you know, it's like, does a, does a caterpillar have imposter syndrome when it knows it's meant to be a butterfly?

[00:46:04] Sabrina Smelko: That's kind of how it is. Like they know they're meant to be a butterfly, but right now I'm not. And I, I'm not in that physical state, but I know I'm going to be, and I know I can evolve to that, but I don't feel like a caterpillar. I don't feel like that butterfly yet. But they still are, doesn't mean that's not in their destiny.

[00:46:20] Sabrina Smelko: So that's how I kind of think about it. And that's the main challenge I see people dealing with. 

[00:46:25] Travis Bader: You know, I, so there's another podcast I'll talk on often called the collective and Chance Burroughs, he's, uh, he made a statement on there and he says, um, the problem with. Sculpting yourself, right, of trying to make yourself into what it is that you think you should be, is that you're both the artist as well as the medium, you're, you're both the artist as well as the, um, um, the, the rock.

[00:46:53] Travis Bader: And. It's going to be painful. It's going to hurt as you start chipping these things away and it's not going to feel comfortable. So I thought that was an interesting sort of like your metamorphosis of the butterfly through the chrysalis and to, um, I also had a, another past podcast guest, a friend of mine, we sat down with a couple other people who've been on the podcast actually, and he's looking at moving.

[00:47:18] Travis Bader: In a new direction with his business and what he'd like to do. He's got so much potential and so much to share. I'm really excited to see what he does with it. I'm not going to pre announce what what's happening here. Uh, but I'll definitely be announcing when he takes that next step. But, uh, uh, the other fellow who's.

[00:47:39] Travis Bader: Very successful in his own right. Kept saying, I think you're having imposter syndrome. And he's like, I'm not having an imposter syndrome. I know where I'm at. I know what I'm doing. And the more I thought about it and I'm looking at this, um, maybe it's just a different definition of what imposter syndrome is because you haven't been there.

[00:47:54] Travis Bader: You haven't done that next thing yet. And the questions that he was asking everybody else that was sitting down, who were providing their insight and their background from, it was like, it was crystal clear to us as to what the next steps were and where we could go. And from his mind, uh, the next, the tiniest next step seemed to be like, like, how do I just start that one?

[00:48:16] Travis Bader: How do I get just that? Cause I can see the other ones as I get rolling, I just don't see that one. Next step. Do you find that in the people that you work with as well? It's just, it's so clear to you where their path is and they just are so hung up on that one little step of. Whatever it is, whatever that mental mind block that they're putting up.

[00:48:35] Travis Bader: What do I call the company? Or how do I collect money or whatever it might be? 

[00:48:39] Sabrina Smelko: Yeah, absolutely. Oh my gosh. Yeah. And it's so interesting if they have that little hangup, they can't get past to the exciting stuff. And what I find and why I do the services I do now, where I always have an intro call and it's one on one exactly like this.

[00:48:55] Sabrina Smelko: And we just shoot the shit for an hour because what I find. The biggest marker for if they're going to be successful and if they're going to do something with their brand is if they're excited about it. Period. Full stop. If you're not excited about your branding or your, how your Instagram looks, or if you can't get behind it and get excited about it and think it's the coolest thing ever, you're not going to be successful.

[00:49:18] Sabrina Smelko: You're not going to put it out there. So I come back to fun and being excited about something and so for a lot of people they can't get to that fun and excitement because they're just so hung up on, I don't know how to get a URL or something interesting. So that's where I come in and that's what I'm trying to do now is offer.

[00:49:34] Sabrina Smelko: Being like your creative counterpart. You know, a lot of us do these things alone. I've launched five different brands totally alone, and I've learned now that they probably would have been ten times more successful if I just had a little bit of help from someone who was equally as excited about what I was gonna do.

[00:49:51] Sabrina Smelko: And just had that someone to bounce stuff off of. Because I think often, especially for people who are launching a new business or brand or something innovative, you're going to get an echo chamber of your, your partner, your friends, your family, they might support you, but you're going to get a lot of, ah, maybe do it like this, or I don't know, like, what if that might be a little too much, or they'll, they might whittle down your dreams a little bit, or at least not be as.

[00:50:16] Sabrina Smelko: generative and excited as you might be. And so that's going to impact your ability to even want to do this thing. What I have in droves is excitement. I can get so jazzed about someone's stuff. I could, I could invent a, uh, I could come up with a funny name that I think of a product for, and I will spend all day searching for it.

[00:50:37] Sabrina Smelko: looking for URLs that match, looking for white label products that I could have under that brand. I get so excited thinking about new things and inventing things. And I've realized that that's a, that's a skill. Like being someone. equally as excited person. I, I get people all the time on calls like, Oh, I think that this would be kind of interesting.

[00:50:58] Sabrina Smelko: I think it would be fun. And just by me going, Yes, that's fun. Oh my goodness. What about this too? Oh, you can add on top of that with this. Then you get a million offshoots of ideas and that's where good stuff comes from. I just think nothing new and original is going to come from not being excited and not throwing spaghetti at the wall.

[00:51:17] Sabrina Smelko: So. My sessions and what I try and do with people is be this person who will toss the spaghetti at the wall when no one else will. 

[00:51:25] Travis Bader: That's funny. I actually had an idea for you. The first time I met you, I had this idea. So you've got the Healer brand and, uh, you make all your own products and you're very successful in marketing and selling them and.

[00:51:38] Travis Bader: I can let you talk about them. I know we've got a bunch of them in our house. Uh, but, uh, a aromatherapy brand, a division of Sabrina's smell Co it's just the goofiest little thing, but I thought that URL and it just, it makes the, it makes the name stick. Anyways, my wife says, don't say that Travis, don't say that.

[00:52:01] Sabrina Smelko: But so that's the fun stuff that I think people like that though. Like it's silly and no one's going to offer that professionally. And I think that's where I, in the past couple months, really have honed in on my services, realizing that there's a ton of professional branding houses and studios where they have staff and big fixed prices and packages.

[00:52:21] Sabrina Smelko: And that's just not me. I'm so one on one. I really, really, I like reading people's energy and trying to figure out the little nugget that gets them excited. And so that's what I just realized. I wanted to. Provide for people was just being that kind of creative counterpart service that isn't necessarily as stuffy as an agency.

[00:52:42] Sabrina Smelko: I just, I think it's important that people get excited and have someone to talk to you. So I think of myself as like part designer, part therapist, part energy worker, part brand counterpart, like whatever you need help with. I just like get keeping people in that excited state because if you're not having fun with your brand and you don't like it and you can't feel like you represent it, you're never going to use it.

[00:53:04] Sabrina Smelko: And it's never going to be successful. 

[00:53:05] Travis Bader: So here's something that you mentioned earlier. You said innovative with someone's doing something innovative. And I think that is one area where you bring a ton of value. You're right. There's a lot of agencies out there. There's a lot of. Cookie cutter formulas.

[00:53:19] Travis Bader: That'll help people through, they'll go to school, they'll learn the process. They got the basics and they can provide that, that background to an individual who might need it. And that works. Like when I was starting Silvercore, there was a, um, the Wardell group, I think it was called Mark Wardell and he had a coaching company.

[00:53:39] Travis Bader: And anyways, he worked out with a fellow I knew and he says, come on in, we'll help you out, we'll get things rolling. And don't, don't worry about it. You're just starting out. You're, I think it was early twenties, late teens, whatever it was. I had no money. And, um, so sat down with one of their business coaches and they give me, they said, this is going to be like a business degree without having to go to business school and call this is fantastic.

[00:54:03] Travis Bader: Right. I suck at school, so I'll get this information. And I found it was so dry and so boring, what that one individual is bringing to me, based on the fact that he had no concept of my industry, it was so foreign or out there. And he's like, Oh, well, you have to do is mingle with other people out there who are successful and hang around.

[00:54:23] Travis Bader: So I'd go to their, their groups and their meetings and, I'm, I'm not saying anything bad about the company because there's a lot of people who found great value in that, but the other people that were doing their businesses were like say real estate agents or they've, they ran a baristas or they, they had businesses that were established in the public mindset and there was a path forward and there's great value to them to, to associate with those others.

[00:54:50] Travis Bader: For me, everyone says, what do you do for work? What is that like, like who's your market. And there's this huge question marks and it. I found that also would find everybody else in your life. You think you can make money at that? I don't think so. You're wasting your time. Why are you pursuing down that endeavor when you could do something that makes sense like this over here.

[00:55:12] Travis Bader: And that's the value that you bring. I find in spades is when you're doing something innovative that doesn't have that roadmap. You can help them see that path forward and he can help other people see it too, because when you tell that story in a way that makes sense, not just to the individual, but other people like, oh, I get it now.

[00:55:34] Travis Bader: I get how you're going to be able to do something or create that story or that desire. There's huge value to that. Anyways, that was 

[00:55:42] Sabrina Smelko: my perspective. And it's yeah. And it is that way though. It's totally individual. It's customized to the person because I'm not going to shoot down someone's. I think I am hoping that I work with more and more innovative people, but that's exactly it.

[00:55:59] Sabrina Smelko: I find there are certain businesses that you can follow the same formula and you know, maybe an agency is the right answer for, for that kind of an individual. But I like working with people who kind of have a different idea or have a little bit of a weird niche or want to. A lot of my clients too are in people who I'm trying to attract more of is people who don't have a brand at all yet.

[00:56:20] Sabrina Smelko: And they're trying to invent it because I don't think you just have to have like a. supplement and this is how you do it. And you just sell it through Instagram. Like I'm really inspired by different ways that people make money. I'm inspired by like software as a service. I'm inspired by the models that people use.

[00:56:38] Sabrina Smelko: There's a nutritionist. I follow a holistic nutritionist and she has a really cool model where the first sessions. 200. You get so much stuff. You get two hours live with her on video. You get a huge package catered to your diet and lifestyle and all that stuff. And then follow up sessions are where like 50 or 100 or something much cheaper.

[00:57:00] Sabrina Smelko: And I was like, that is very smart. I like to think about how that model could be used for someone else. You know, maybe, um, a counselor or someone in a different field. Like, I really do want to help people figure out what a business might be that isn't traditional. Not a brick and mortar shop, maybe not a retail.

[00:57:17] Sabrina Smelko: Maybe it's, maybe it's subscription boxes or a seasonal box or a cool set or... You do jewelry, but it's only sets of jewelry or I don't know. I just really like thinking about like weird, fun, new ways to use technology, to use social media, to use domains, to use all these different platforms to like come up with a new business, come up with a new service, like provide something totally unique.

[00:57:40] Sabrina Smelko: And so that's what, if you want to get those kinds of ideas in your head, that's what I hope to bring to people. And that's the kind of people I want to work with. 

[00:57:49] Travis Bader: I get asked a fair bit in the sort of outdoors industry of where do I see a possible business? Where do I see, uh, the future, the trend of, uh, of what we're doing used to be a lot about the firearm side.

[00:58:04] Travis Bader: Where do I see the, uh, the trends of that moving? Um, and when I was younger, I had a whole ton of ideas and I was a little bit reluctant to share these ideas. Like, what if you go off and take it? What if you. Uh, take that idea and go run with it. And nowadays I share them all because I've realized that it's only going to be better for us in general, if a good idea takes off, but most people aren't going to take that step.

[00:58:31] Travis Bader: Even if you give them a roadmap and the perfect idea, the vast majority of people out there. I don't know what it is. They don't believe in it. They don't believe in themselves. If lack the courage, whatever it might be, they'll come up with reasons to not take off on whatever that, that different thing is.

[00:58:47] Travis Bader: It's too much work, I think is what it generally boils down to and nothing worthwhile ever comes easy. But I do know that if you put that effort into any one of these ideas, that you'll be successful. Now, whether you turn around and say, man, I could have been just as successful or more successful in an easier fashion.

[00:59:06] Travis Bader: Maybe, maybe not, but if it sparks that passion in you, who cares if the other one was easier, you enjoyed yourself in the process and you're going to outperform anybody out there who's doing it just for the money. Who's not performing. 

[00:59:21] Sabrina Smelko: Comes back to that word, enjoyment, fun, being excited and enjoying life.

[00:59:26] Sabrina Smelko: If you're in that energy, your life is good. Period. It doesn't matter what you're doing. And that's just been the biggest lesson of my life is yeah. Making it. Enjoyable, fun, making sure that you're feeling good at anything you're doing. 

[00:59:42] Travis Bader: So I deal with a number of people who have their own TV shows and, uh, or who are aspiring to have their own TV show.

[00:59:52] Travis Bader: And now with YouTube, it's getting easier than ever for people to have a video presence, but you took it to a higher level than what most people do. Just having a TOK channel. You're, you're on HGTV and a regular series. If somebody wanted to pursue that as a bit of a path, what would that look like for them?

[01:00:13] Travis Bader: And what sort of advice would you give to yourself with the knowledge you have now, if you were looking to do that? 

[01:00:23] Sabrina Smelko: I heard the best piece of advice when I was first starting from Sarah Baumler, actually. Um, we were at a Chorus Upfronts, which is this big event where HGTV kind of parades their talent out on stage, and they want advertisers to buy into the shows, to have their commercials in their slots.

[01:00:41] Sabrina Smelko: And so all of us HGTV talent, you know, McGilvries, Holmes, and the Baumlers, all these people, I'm kind of the newer girl, and I don't really know these people. to be honest. Everyone's been fantastic. And I will never forget. I was standing behind Sarah Baumler and she introduced herself to me and we just started chatting and you never know how much time you have to talk until a producer's like, okay, get on stage or whatever you need to do.

[01:01:06] Sabrina Smelko: And I'll never forget. She Gave me the best advice. I didn't even really ask her advice or I don't know how it came up But naturally she was just like do you have your own like do you have a blog or a brand or a anything like that? And at the time I didn't so my answer was just no I have this show. I'm excited.

[01:01:23] Sabrina Smelko: I'm new, you know This is my co host. I was just so naive and she goes You need your own thing. If you're gonna go into television, without at least a blog, or a publication, or a magazine, or a single product, what's the point? She's like, this is all great, but it's great advertising for what you actually want to do.

[01:01:45] Sabrina Smelko: Don't just let this be the end all. Don't let you having the show be the product. The product isn't the show, the product is what you want to do. And unless you have your own business or brand or something you want to say, what are you here for? And that was right at the beginning of before I even started filming.

[01:02:03] Sabrina Smelko: And I think I only had like maybe a couple episodes under my belt at that point. And I just stuck with me so much. And I never forgot that. And I think that's why I ended up quitting in a large part was because I knew I needed to build my own thing before I would ever possibly even get back into television.

[01:02:21] Sabrina Smelko: And if you have. A presence and a platform, but no, nothing of your own that you own. What's the point? People are going to just think of you as that girl on TV and pigeonhole you as to what they think. Unless you have your own definition of yourself. And I didn't. I was still learning who I was. I was young.

[01:02:39] Sabrina Smelko: I was 24, 25. And so that stuck with me. My biggest advice would be, Know what you want to offer. Know your why and know what you're passionate about that you want to fall back. Maybe you don't already have a brand or business, but be very clear on what you want to promote in the world. And I was not clear back then at what I wanted to help people with.

[01:03:00] Travis Bader: I like that a lot. And that's something that I've come to terms with as well. And that's, I just call it having your North star and always knowing what that North star is, and that's going to be something that's hopefully bigger than you and that every part of your life that you're working on can somehow work towards that to whatever that North star is going to be.

[01:03:21] Travis Bader: If your North star is to be. Uh, a great, uh, father or mother. And, and you define that greatness as being able to provide and emotionally, financially, and whatever it might be. Then you can say, every is what I'm doing right now, working towards that is my resting working towards that. Cause maybe it is. And that's an area that I find a lot of people gloss.

[01:03:46] Travis Bader: Over, or maybe I'm just not looking in the right areas, but there's a lot of, um, work hard, strive, don't give up, be tenacious, uh, work harder than the next person. Take that next step. Right. And even when we're talking about these wavelengths and how am I, how am I striving to get high and that, okay, now I'm on a low turn because I'm doing something new and I'm learning, okay, I'm high again.

[01:04:10] Travis Bader: Uh, at what point do we sit back and say, okay, it's time for a break for a bit, right? I don't need to push it at these sort of, of high levels. I don't know. Have you, do you hear that talked about much, or is that something that you think about? Like maybe, maybe I don't need to be going 110 miles an hour all the time.

[01:04:33] Travis Bader: Maybe I'll just do it for a month and then I'll take the rest off. 

[01:04:36] Sabrina Smelko: Yeah, but I find that's hard, especially in television, because you gotta keep up and you gotta jump into the next thing and stay relevant. And so that's a tough ride, ride to, sorry, wave to ride. And I clearly didn't know how to do it. I mean, I quit because I didn't know how to balance that.

[01:04:56] Sabrina Smelko: Um, and I also felt though that because I entered television quite naive and I didn't have my North star, so to speak, that was also contributing to it. But it's a tough balance. You really, I, my next piece of advice, I guess, anyone who wanted to kind of go into television would really be protect your energy and be an executive producer on the show as well.

[01:05:19] Sabrina Smelko: Like if you're, if your name and likeness is being used, you need to have a say on. How that final edit is shown. And that's something that I did not have at all. My co host had those credits and he was able to edit and, um, control kind of how he appeared on the show. And that was something that because I was naive and going into the negotiations with the contracts, I represented myself and so.

[01:05:43] Sabrina Smelko: You know, I should have known better, but having that control over your image is huge. And so, yeah, being an executive producer on anything that you're in, if you're on a show or on a YouTube or anything is definitely something to consider. That's 

[01:05:56] Travis Bader: something I never would have thought of. Never would have thought of that.

[01:06:01] Travis Bader: That, that is a good point. They say, don't fear the camera, fear the edit. Right? 

[01:06:05] Sabrina Smelko: Absolutely. Cause what's shocking is there would be, I think it was calculated out at 18. Anywhere from 15 to 20 shoot days for a half an hour of television. So that's 18 full 16 hour days. So think about how much footage that is and how much gets.

[01:06:25] Sabrina Smelko: So you might say the whole speech you want to say and you feel good about that's going to be in the scene and it's not in the scene. It's, it's formatted. Almost every single television show you see is so formatted to the 30 seconds, to the 30 seconds, to the minute, to the one second mark. So it's all very controlled and If you do want to say something specific and you do want to show, because you want that platform to say something, you have to be an executive producer on the show, or you will not get your words out.

[01:06:55] Travis Bader: That's smart. You know, I, I was asked to be on CNN a while ago and, uh, I was very flattered. I was on there with this FBI guy and we're talking about some stuff that was going on in the States. And, uh, I was all proud of this long conversation, only like little snippets came out of like, man, I said so much great stuff, but they only use the tiniest little bit.

[01:07:15] Travis Bader: And, um, Uh, friend of mine who works for government. And he's like, he's asking me a bunch of questions. And he's like, well, hold on a second. Have you had any media training? I'm like, no. Right. He's like, okay. Um, even on these tiny little things like this, like it's not a full show that you have, you're, you're just doing the, uh, a quick interview.

[01:07:36] Travis Bader: You should have that, that same sort of understanding. Like what you're saying at the beginning, they're selling something, they've got an agenda of where they want to go with this. You ask them, what is it? Right. And then tell them what it is that you want to see put out and then have a proper understanding as you go through that.

[01:07:51] Travis Bader: So even on this, the smallest sort of interaction, something I never would have thought about, I know next time, if I'm ever asked to be on CNN again, then I will, uh, I'll have that conversation. And maybe, maybe the, uh, the preparation and, and hard work that I put in for, uh, at least sounding halfway articulate and clever will actually come out in the final product.

[01:08:14] Sabrina Smelko: And you also too, though, realize there's a lot that you end up saying that are not your words that are coerced because what people forget is there are multiple producers on television shows and their only job is to get the people who are on camera to say certain things. Period. So, it's, it's not that it's necessarily scripted, but there are beats.

[01:08:35] Sabrina Smelko: It's called a beat sheet. You get a beat sheet from the scene, and these are the beats that we have to hit in the scene, because these are the only things we're going to air. Everything outside of these beats, doesn't matter if you tell a funny, cool story, it's probably not going to make it, because it's not in the beat, and only the beats fit in that time slot before the commercial.

[01:08:52] Sabrina Smelko: So, you realize, too, that you end up, I would watch edits back and be like, I never... I said that, but I guess I did, because someone asked me a question trying to coerce that exact reply, and I would fall for it all the time. I, I was an actress. I grew up doing, like, theater camp, so it was so... easy for me to people please and kind of if I knew that they were trying to get this certain thing out of the scene sometimes I would even just say it to get the scene over with because I was like I'm hungry, lunch is next and no one's saying this thing like I'll just say it and get it over with but you kind of like undermine yourself sometimes and it's not awesome to feel good about What you're saying when you know it's just to get to lunch faster, and it wouldn't come naturally if you, you know, We're just talking like that normal.

[01:09:41] Sabrina Smelko: Yeah, it's very very much manipulated. Gently, you know, nothing is forced. We're, even with the homeowners, you know, you're not telling the homeowners to say this or that. However, in how you ask a question, much like in an interrogation, how you ask someone a question can really dictate their answer. And so, when you see those interview style things on television, someone has just asked them a question, and then you hear their reply.

[01:10:05] Sabrina Smelko: So often, it's not necessarily what they would say, it's just a reaction to a question that they maybe would have never even talked about. So, it's, you have to be careful with... How you represent yourself and be very conscious that that happens in television. And I think because I didn't know that, or I was a little naive to it, I, it run me down a little bit and it would bum me out then when I would see the edit.

[01:10:31] Sabrina Smelko: But now in hindsight, if I ever went back into television, I think with that knowledge and you just don't say it, don't say anything you don't want aired. 

[01:10:38] Travis Bader: Yeah. Unless it's like Homer Simpson, when he was getting interrogated for the gummy Venus de Milo. And you see the clock behind him and it's jumping all over the place.

[01:10:46] Travis Bader: And. They have them on the inside edition or whatever it is that they just completely misquoting, I'm picking up the little parts, playing it back and forth. But, uh, yeah, which I guess can happen. And you're right. You know, how a question is asked will definitely elicit, uh, like you can ask a binary question, which presupposes only two answers, but neither of them fits you.

[01:11:10] Travis Bader: And so often, and that was something that I found a lot, cause you know, I was on CBC and, uh, a couple of times and each time I was on, I got a little bit better, but I, and I talked to the, uh, the reporter ahead of time and get a bit of a sense and I'm like, now, am I going to be the best person for this?

[01:11:28] Travis Bader: Probably not from their perspective. Cause I, I start getting really cautious about how I answer. They had asked one thing and I'd answer something completely different. What I know to be true. Right. Um, I had one with, from my perspective, yes, uh, from their perspective, maybe it's going to be a little more difficult to use that.

[01:11:48] Travis Bader: Maybe that's why things do get cut down. I had one where, um, I was asked to speak on an event and, uh, I, I just wasn't in the right head space. And I, I thought back and forth and I'm like, you know what? I know another person. And I referred another person over for them to speak to, and I listened to what he said and I disagreed with everything that he said, because I would have answered it differently.

[01:12:12] Travis Bader: But what he said was absolutely perfect for what needed to be said on, on that, uh, on that clip, I think it was about, um, getting illegal guns, getting, uh, firearms illegally in Canada. And he says, it's impossible. You can't do that. You can't get, you can't get a gun. You have to go through a course. Here's how you do it.

[01:12:32] Travis Bader: And he goes through this whole process of, um, background checks, criminal record checks, and everything else that's required. Whereas my head wasn't quite as black and white. And I'd be like, well, I guess if somebody was going to do things illegally, they would smuggle one across or they do. Now I'm sure if I gave that one, that interview, all of those tidbits would come out and it would sound terrible.

[01:12:54] Travis Bader: He comes across with just a, nope, you can't do it. Absolutely impossible. 

[01:12:58] Sabrina Smelko: Interesting. Did you know that that was the question going in before? 

[01:13:02] Travis Bader: I had a sense of, uh, what they would be talking about ahead of time. And 

[01:13:07] Sabrina Smelko: interesting. I find that because with the show as well, one of the things we would make sure of is that the homeowners were kind of always kept in the dark about what was coming next, because then you would get the answers and reactions.

[01:13:22] Sabrina Smelko: That you would want more if they, if you kept them in the dark, I'm just thinking of a random question, like if they didn't know that mold was discovered, we would go, what would you think if mold was discovered in your house? And then they'd react like that and it obviously would be mold and so you'd splice it all together and it's like you're getting this visceral emotional reaction to something that's not even real.

[01:13:44] Sabrina Smelko: You're just trying to get a hypothetical, but we know it actually is real. So I'm curious if you knew your question in advance because I found that that would be something that was used a lot too was Asking them the question on the spot when they're on camera to get the most People kind of they don't want to give a bad answer.

[01:14:04] Sabrina Smelko: They they want to appear politically correct There's five people looking at them. So the answer you get is To me, it just doesn't feel as authentic as if you knew what the question was gonna be, you had some time to prepare. That would probably be a more honest answer, but yes, that's not the goal with, uh, with that kind of television, is get them kind of right in that state of reaction in the most unknown and uncomfortable.

[01:14:29] Travis Bader: My, I think the, my first CBC interview I did, I was early twenties. And I think, um, the interviewer took pity on me afterwards cause they didn't air some of the stuff that was, that was said, but his advice was at the end, you know, a lot of people feel that they have to have all the answers when the camera's on them and they have to say something, sometimes you don't have to say anything at all or just say.

[01:14:56] Travis Bader: That's a good question. I don't know. And I'm like, well, that was really polite way. And I have saying, he asked me to speculate on something that was completely outside of my, my comfort level or spectrum of knowledge, uh, in the political sphere. And, uh, I could have just as easily declined that question.

[01:15:16] Travis Bader: You don't have to, Oh, he's answer. You don't have to be, yeah. Same thing with interrogation, interview and interrogation. I've done courses with the Reed Institute and the VPD and a few others on. 

[01:15:28] Sabrina Smelko: Really interesting. So I know you haven't always been super comfortable even like doing interviews and stuff.

[01:15:35] Sabrina Smelko: What do you think, is it just like the amount of times you've done it has built comfort for you or have you practiced in other ways? Like what has made you comfortable public speaking? 

[01:15:44] Travis Bader: It's definitely not something I've ever really become comfortable with, but I What I enjoy is the personal connection.

[01:15:51] Travis Bader: And I, I enjoy talking to people one on one and having that conversation. And if I'm talking to a large group, I essentially, when I'm teaching, I look at the group as if it's one individual with a bunch of different questions, a bunch of different personalities, and I approach it from the mindset of.

[01:16:11] Travis Bader: Here's where their knowledge level is. Here's what I'd like to be able to get them to. What value can I bring to them? And what's the most effective way for me to get them from point A to point B. And I look at that as a challenge and the teaching side, when I'm doing the podcast, I don't think it's something I'm ever going to be comfortable with.

[01:16:30] Travis Bader: I never wanted to have my face out there or my voice out there as see the head of silver core. It's a whole reason I called it silver core and not Travis core. Right. Or I figured it'd be great to have something that was independent of me. The issue I found is, and it goes back to what you're talking about, about having some sort of, what is it that you're.

[01:16:51] Travis Bader: Uh, what's your personal brand? What is it that you're bringing along with your TV show or whatever it might be? If you build something up that is so independent from you, uh, particularly an area with a low barrier to entry, uh, it's easy for other people to, to mimic or copy or, uh, or steal. And I've seen that happen a number of times and kind of dilutes the, the, um, the playing field a little bit, but the one thing they can't dilute or take or copy is my face and my voice and my thoughts and my opinion.

[01:17:28] Travis Bader: So I figured. Back in 2019, was it around there? I'm going to jump in. Some friends are saying every person has to be a media company. Every business has to be a media company. Gary Vaynerchuk said it to be true. So it's gotta be true. And I said, okay, I'm not comfortable at all. I absolutely feel like an imposter doing this.

[01:17:52] Travis Bader: But here we go. And I just jumped in and did it. And I still, uh, you know, I'll do my, my prep work ahead of time as I go through. And I guess practice makes it a little bit more, uh, uh, proficient, but it's still something that, um, uh, I wouldn't say is my a hundred percent comfort zone. Hmm. Is it your comfort 

[01:18:12] Sabrina Smelko: zone?

[01:18:14] Sabrina Smelko: Um, it actually is. Yeah. I, I, I, yeah, I feel very comfortable Really? Yeah. In this kind of a setting. Yeah. I do. I almost more than. If I didn't have an audience talking about something. Interesting. I don't know why that is. I've always just been very much like a mirror with other people. I, I'm really just fascinated by life and I feel like unless I'm talking about it and someone's hearing it, it doesn't exist almost.

[01:18:42] Sabrina Smelko: So I've always just been very much an echo chamber with my friends. I was always the one talking the most and I'm very outgoing and in group settings. Ironically, I'm a little bit more of an introvert and I do gain that energy back and require that alone time, but I've always loved being in crowds and talking.

[01:18:59] Sabrina Smelko: And I was that kid though, who would. embarrass myself like pretending I had a horse I was riding and invisible animals and doing a cart wheel at the beginning of recess to enter another dimension. And it never bugged me to have eyes on me. It never bugged me that people thought I was different or weird.

[01:19:17] Sabrina Smelko: I always almost liked it. I found it kind of endearing. Like if people. I thought it was weird. I almost wanted to make up a language to weird them out more. I don't know what it is. I I'm always pushing people's buttons. Maybe that's part of my personality. 

[01:19:33] Travis Bader: You're like happy Gilmore's grandma riding the horse.

[01:19:39] Sabrina Smelko: Oh, I'll never forget the cars looking out the window, just me with my legs as wide as I could after that, like 10 years old, walking down the sidewalk as if I'm riding a horse. I kind of, I've just always liked getting a rise out of people and pranking people and I was a huge prankster. I always got in trouble.

[01:19:56] Sabrina Smelko: I just, I was so boring and regimented, like just the school of it, the system of it. I was just like, this is so boring. Like, we're chopping down the tree now because it's unsafe? Like, come on. Like, I've just always kind of questioned when we did anything to fit in or be formal or follow a... Routine. I've always really fought that so I think even with public speaking being shy or being like oh I'm afraid to say that I would be like I want to prove to people that it's so not something to be afraid of because What's the worst that happens you?

[01:20:31] Sabrina Smelko: Yell out a random word at someone who's a stranger and they kind of just look at you and laugh and maybe you actually made Their day, I don't know I think as a kid I just saw that a lot where I was the youngest of three and to get attention sometimes you just have to do crazy stuff and The reaction would usually be entertainment or joy, so I just never was shy about speaking, talking, being out there, because it helped me feel...

[01:20:56] Sabrina Smelko: When I was like that, I wasn't feeling the other bad emotions that I was referencing before, you know? Like, if I was being weird and out there and talking, at least people could... judge me for those things as opposed to when I'm quiet alone and sad I didn't want to be judged for that or known for that. I want it to be known for being wild and being okay with that.

[01:21:19] Sabrina Smelko: So it's like these two parts of me ever since I was young that we're kind of like competing. And one side really cared what people thought and the other side was trying to prove that. By not caring what people think you can be free and happy. And I feel like I was always battling that. It's funny as a kid.

[01:21:36] Travis Bader: Is that isolating though? I mean, if you're going to be not caring about what everybody says, because I can, I can sympathize with all the things you just said there growing up, you know, I was a class clown and there's easier to do that than pay attention in school. And man, I didn't. Didn't fit in with a traditional school system.

[01:21:55] Travis Bader: I think by grade seven, I had one, two, three, I think it was only three desks. I had no four, I had four desks. So I had my desk in the classroom. I had a desk at the back of the class. You know, if I'm feeling like super energetic, I had a desk in the hallway and I had a desk in the principal's office. I was the only person with a desk in the principal's office.

[01:22:18] Travis Bader: And, uh, you know, I got straight A's in grade four at a teacher who's just like, you know what, I don't know how to control you. Um, but you seem to really like puzzles. So go nuts with your puzzles. You seem to, you've got this college level chemistry book that you're, you're enjoy reading. Do you want to bring your chemistry set in?

[01:22:36] Travis Bader: And you can teach chemistry at a lunch break. And for me, chemistry was all about making invisible ink and blowing things up. I mean, that's. You know, if there's some sort of a exothermic reaction associated with whatever you're mixing together, that's cool. Right. And, um, I got straight A's by grade seven.

[01:22:54] Travis Bader: I had straight F's, but the teacher says, you know what, that was midterm by the final report card. I'm like, I guess I'm repeating the grade. Teacher's like, I gave you just high enough grades to get through. I don't want to see you in my class again. I think high school will do a lot more for you than I'll ever be able to do for you.

[01:23:11] Travis Bader: I'm like, adios, sounds good to me. 

[01:23:14] Sabrina Smelko: So isn't that funny though, that at that age, when you're in like elementary school, you kind of, that's when you first are like, you're the truest, most authentic part of you comes out and like being good at puzzles and having those kind of moments of like what your services are now almost in a way, or what makes up your personality now.

[01:23:32] Sabrina Smelko: And then you also, on the other hand. are being told to fit in this box, being told you have to do this, attend this room from these times, and it's like you're fighting two very, that age is just so interesting in elementary school, where, and I think back to myself as well, like, we sound like we were both so authentic, we knew these little interests that we have, that we still have, but yet, you're kind of boxed in with all these other kids, and they all want you to...

[01:23:56] Sabrina Smelko: It's like tall poppy syndrome. You, everyone has to kind of stay at the same level, grow at the same rate. Even though like as kids we all already have these little strengths and skills and gifts. Everyone is such individual gifts and like It's just I wish people would foster that more and I feel like that's even why I'm doing now.

[01:24:14] Sabrina Smelko: What I'm doing is to try and like Respark that in people of like, what were you excited about as a kid? What were those things that you're naturally good at? What are your gifts that you're meant to bring to the world? Like forget the job that you think you have to be doing or just because that's what your mom or society or your teacher told you.

[01:24:31] Sabrina Smelko: Like, I think that rebellious side myself as a young kid is now what I'm doing for work. Almost. I'm showing other young me's like. You don't have to follow that format. Like, what if you just continued being that excited, energetic, passionate kid your whole life and followed that. And so I'm trying to like bring that back out and help people kind of return to that in a way.

[01:24:54] Travis Bader: Yeah, I think it takes a heck of a lot of effort. And I think that's why the current education system is what it is, because there's a formula in place and there's a, there's a business behind it. And, uh, It helps, you know, it helps a lot of people, but it's not to have a bespoke sort of, uh, curriculum for each individual would just be too onerous.

[01:25:17] Travis Bader: It'd be too much money. It'd be too much time. Uh, And that's where I think the parents should play a very active role in how they educate their children, because there are minimum standards that people need to know. And we do that with our kids. What's the minimum standards we need to know for them to graduate this year.

[01:25:33] Travis Bader: Great. We'll get that done today. Right now we can spend the rest of the time doing whatever, right? Like our son is working towards 14 years old and they both get great, great. So daughter gets straight A's every year. She's been in high school and, um, But we get to expose them, double down on what it is they're good at, as opposed to let's get you a tutor so we can really get you better at whatever it is they might be poor at.

[01:26:01] Travis Bader: Why? Let's just get you through what you're poor at and just double down. We'll get you a tutor for the one that, if you're really into aerodynamics and you want to just learn about that, we'll foster that now. 

[01:26:13] Sabrina Smelko: Cool. That's an awesome approach. I wish I had that when I was a kid. That's. Do you find like with their friends and stuff who maybe don't have that, do you see a difference in the attitude of the kids?

[01:26:24] Travis Bader: Yeah, I, I think it's, um, it also changes the type of people that they would be hanging around. Maybe that's the frequency you're talking about before. 

[01:26:34] Sabrina Smelko: I can't wait to see like what your kids end up getting into and are interested in and what services or things that they provide the world. I just feel like that.

[01:26:43] Sabrina Smelko: It's a more well rounded approach when, like you said, there's, yes, the school is important, and yes, there's a reason for that for sure, but They obviously have this knowledge that that's not the end all be all. I'm sure you don't pressure them to ace everything. Clearly you have instilled other more important things in them and interests in the outdoors and that kind of stuff.

[01:27:02] Sabrina Smelko: And that I'm sure even just helps their mental health. 

[01:27:06] Travis Bader: Yeah. I try and get them out fishing or hunting or doing like, come on, let's skip school. Ah, no, I can't. Cause I got to do this and that. Are you kidding me? Like at that age, I'm like, see ya, I'm gone. I got approval to skip school and it's really had the reverse effect of.

[01:27:22] Travis Bader: Interesting. Yeah. So our daughter wants to be a doctor. And so she's very, grades obviously are important if you want to be a doctor. And so she's working towards that. And, uh, our son, he's easier to convince to, uh, to skip school. But even now there's, there's days when he's like, no, I'm, there's an important lesson we got to cut in.

[01:27:40] Travis Bader: That's hilarious.

[01:27:45] Sabrina Smelko: Yeah. Never would have a question for you actually, which is. Something I struggle with is having a big far out goal or thinking of myself as old or what I'm going to be doing then. You saying I'm old? No, I'm asking if you have, do you have a vision of yourself when you're older? Do you, can you see that?

[01:28:06] Sabrina Smelko: Or are you like me where I find personally, I'm most successful when I don't think about that. And when I just operate in my present day and try and make this day good, I really, I can visualize a lot of things, and I can invent a lot of stuff, but I really find it hard thinking about myself when I'm 80, 90, whatever it may be.

[01:28:28] Sabrina Smelko: I just, I find it tough to, it's the one thing in my life I can't pre plan or visualize or have ideas for. I'm very much today, and I don't know if that's...

[01:28:41] Travis Bader: I think that's a good question. You know, growing up, my parents didn't think I'd live past nine. It's kind of a weird thing for a parent to tell their kid, but, uh, fair enough. I was just out there just go, go, go, go crazy stuff. Let's jump off the roof. Let's whatever, right. I'll just run across traffic. And then when I made it past nine, they said, I don't think you're going to be able to make it past 18.

[01:29:05] Travis Bader: Right. I, we, I don't think you're Yeah, something's gonna happen between now and then, and maybe they, maybe my mom was predisposed, her brother died at 21. He was, uh, blown up a grenade in a training accident. And, you know, she was always of the mindset, it's good to have more than one kid in case you lose one.

[01:29:21] Travis Bader: So maybe that was sitting in the back of the head. Right. But, um, and maybe I was the one that, uh, was mentally prepared to, uh, to disappear at some point. But I, even at those ages, I never had a, I always had the concept that I could die. I could die the next day. And I'm not going to make it to those milestones.

[01:29:41] Travis Bader: Better live it out loud, do what I want, want to do. It's not conducive to, uh, perhaps not getting into trouble when you're younger. Um, but. So even now I look at every day as if. It could be the last, you know, that death sits on your, your every word. And I don't have any vision of what the future looks like.

[01:30:06] Travis Bader: It's not smart to play the game as if every day is your last. Otherwise everyone would be broke. They blow all their savings or people would be extremely hung over the next day or, or whatever. Right. Um, put a plan in place to ensure that, um, we're working towards something. But no, I, I don't see myself necessarily as getting old because I think age is a construct.

[01:30:30] Travis Bader: I mean, the fact that your body ages is something, sure, our body will get older, but I, I, a lot of my friends are in their eighties or older and. Man, they don't think of themselves as old. Once they hit about 20, that's sort of where the brain kind of solidified and their body's getting older and they've got pains and aches.

[01:30:52] Travis Bader: But the way they think about things is just, uh, maybe accented with a bit more experience. So I think from a, uh, a mental perspective, I definitely see myself learning more as I, as I grow, as each day goes by. Cause I love that every day. I'd love to learn more and more and more. Um, I find great. Value in that.

[01:31:15] Travis Bader: And then being able to share what I'm learning with the right people, people who will appreciate it, but no, I don't have an idea of me sitting in a rocking chair and on the deck watching the sunset. I see myself doing pretty much the same sort of things. Like I am now minus any physical capabilities.

[01:31:36] Sabrina Smelko: Totally. Okay, good. That's kind of comforting because I've always wondered that myself a lot of questions I get are like, where do you see yourself or what's your goal? And I sometimes feel weird that I don't have that but to your exact point, that's That's, that's, I guess the point is there, you're always learning your, there isn't really a destination unless the destination is yeah, in a wheelchair and in an old age home or something.

[01:32:02] Sabrina Smelko: But I find that just hard to think about because yeah, my mind feels young. My mind body might change, but yeah, I still feel, I've always found that a hard thing to think about because I'm like, well, my mind doesn't feel any older or younger than when I first started thinking my first thought, you know?

[01:32:18] Sabrina Smelko: So, 

[01:32:19] Travis Bader: and I think it'd be. Incredibly depressing as well. If you get to that point, what happens if you have this idea in your head that, all right, this is what I look like. This is what the end game, I've got my mortgage paid off, I've got X amount in the bank account, I've accomplished X, Y, Z goals. What happens if you accomplish all of that early?

[01:32:39] Travis Bader: Now, now what? Are we done? And what happens if you never accomplished those goals that you're working towards? And that milepost keeps getting put further and further. Oh, I didn't think I'd live this long. Like I remember my grandma, she'd always say, man, all my friends are dead. I'm, I might as well die.

[01:32:56] Travis Bader: You know? And I'd look at this and be like, how depressing, right? And of course, you know, telling a kid dog, no, Graham, we don't want you dead. No, no, no. I should be dead. Everyone hits husband, kids, dead friends are dead. But I guess I'm guessing that. Uh, what it was that she was living for wasn't something that maybe she had those goals or goals are done.

[01:33:18] Travis Bader: And it was just now a process of living out the days. I can never see that for myself because what brings me joy and what brings me value is creating new things, learning new things, creating things, using that to impact my surroundings, to help bring others up around me. If I'm doing that, I feel fulfilled.

[01:33:38] Travis Bader: That's fantastic. And that's a never ending process. I could be doing it through Silvercore. I could be doing it through some of my hobbies. I can hopefully impart some stuff and share what I know through the podcast. And maybe that resonates with somebody, but that's, um, yeah, that's, that's kind of where I see things.

[01:33:57] Travis Bader: I don't ever see stopping working. There is no freedom 55 for retirement. I can see the need to work for a certain base level diminishing. But I'm always going to work. I mean, it's, you need that struggle in your life. You need to be pushing yourself physically. You need to be pushing yourself mentally. Uh, and you need to recover and recoup so that you can watch yourself get stronger and go to the next stage.

[01:34:28] Sabrina Smelko: You grow, grow, grow until it ends, I guess. 

[01:34:31] Travis Bader: Or doesn't that depends on how you look at it. Right. 

[01:34:33] Sabrina Smelko: But yeah, true. That's another topic altogether. Um, and business wise, I mean, podcast is It's obviously just your own interests and that's so vast, but I remember last time we were chatting, you were discussing maybe the possibility of adding a little bit more like online courses and stuff.

[01:34:52] Sabrina Smelko: And as someone, I mean, I manage your Instagram, I see so many comments of gimme foraging courses and more of that kind of stuff. Are you expanding those kinds of things as well? 

[01:35:03] Travis Bader: We are, yeah, it's, it's something that, uh, so we've been providing content over, I know Tiffany is the, uh, the resident forager here at Silvercore.

[01:35:12] Travis Bader: She knows, she knows more information. She's forgotten more information than I'll probably ever know. Uh, putting that together in a, uh, in a cohesive format for people. I think is, uh, is important. And I know she's got a lot of notes on that. We have, and 

[01:35:27] Sabrina Smelko: as a chef too, I mean, the food side of things, she can offer so many great recipes, like people, I think we need 

[01:35:33] Travis Bader: that.

[01:35:35] Travis Bader: Well, you should see the garden in the yard. We don't grow anything you can't eat, right? And if some people grow nice looking flowers and that's great and all, but if you can't eat it, you won't find it in our yard. And really, eh? Yeah. That's awesome. We've got the boneyard in the front because I just keep finding skulls and bones.

[01:35:51] Travis Bader: And, and so I just keep throwing them into the, into the front garden and, uh, my, my little collection. And then she's got, um, all the different food types that are out there, but it's, it's amazing what you can forage and find just growing out of the cracks of a sidewalk. And once you know what to look for, and there's a lot of things that are edible.

[01:36:12] Travis Bader: But not everything tastes good. So understanding how to properly, uh, prepare things or what to look for. Uh, yes, it's something that we've been exploring and looking at and opening up for the members as well as a, uh, as a service. Cause I, I have seen a lot more interest from people in that. And I think the idea of self sufficiency in people is COVID awakened and it's.

[01:36:35] Travis Bader: Absolutely. 

[01:36:36] Sabrina Smelko: Perhaps going dormant. Even myself. 

[01:36:37] Travis Bader: Yeah. Well, you took the firearms course, right? Would you, would have you done that if not for COVID? 

[01:36:44] Sabrina Smelko: Probably not. No, honestly, I wouldn't have. In fact, years ago, I was, my partner once asked me, would you be ever interested in getting your firearms license or us having something like that?

[01:36:54] Sabrina Smelko: And I remember being kind of upset at him. To be honest, I was like, no, I, I, it just, it was an unknown. It was a fear based thing. And I think that's where a lot of people come from is you hear gun and you just get afraid if you don't know. And that comes back to naivety. Like I was. It's, I didn't, I wasn't educated.

[01:37:12] Sabrina Smelko: I didn't know why you maybe would want one or need one or how they're, how they work. Even just the safety aspect of it. If you don't know about them, you think that they're just, it's loose in the house and someone's going to walk in and use it on you or something. It's just, you go into irrational places, right?

[01:37:28] Sabrina Smelko: So, but once you start just learning more about, I mean, we moved out here into, we're on like half an acre. It's not much, but. I think once we moved here and started just working our land a little bit more and being curious. I've always loved cooking and food, but being more curious about getting my ingredients from my garden instead of the grocery store.

[01:37:50] Sabrina Smelko: And that was kind of like my soft launch into being a little bit more sovereign, I guess. And getting into this stuff and learning how to protect myself and, and, and also hunting. I'm definitely curious to get into that a little bit. I love animals. So I find that. I'm sure is the biggest hurdle for everybody, but how you guys talk about it and what I've learned since just being more involved in Silvercore is there's so much more reverence and respect for life and for the animals and for Earth than I ever would have thought in this kind of an industry would have.

[01:38:25] Sabrina Smelko: Like when I took that, that course, the, I was just, I mean, the instructor was hilarious. He had so many great stories, but even though he had tons of dad jokes, you could just, you couldn't not feel the passion for. The respect of the, the craft, the respect of the animal, if you were to take their life for food, like how everything was talked about and it just made a lot more sense to me and it's a lot more holistic and respectful than I ever imagined.

[01:38:55] Sabrina Smelko: Cause you think of it as such a violent thing or, you know, you just think of war when you hear guns, maybe naively, but. It's not, that's not what it's about. You know, we've had, if you think even back to our ancestors, thousands of years, we've been working with tools and weapons and guns for our own survival or for defense or for food.

[01:39:15] Sabrina Smelko: And it's just. I don't know that education side of it has really opened my eyes. I didn't, I was definitely naive about it before and afraid. 

[01:39:24] Travis Bader: The conversation has changed a lot in the last number of years and firearms have been vilified and glorified. And I think the biggest thing that. I can do with silver core.

[01:39:35] Travis Bader: And you've been helping a lot with that is to not make the firearm, the object of the intention. It just happens to be a tool. It happens. I mean, the cliche is like Homer Simpson, the firearms, a tool, like a wrench or an alligator, whatever he meant by that. And it's, it's just, it's something that's used, people don't look at cars with the same feeling.

[01:39:57] Travis Bader: Fear as they would a firearm, because it's not, although cars are used in, in movies and they'll race them around and they'll do crazy things with them. It's. You're exposed to them on a daily basis. And you realize the fact that yes, they need respect. Yes. You have to handle them properly. Yes. They can cause horrific injuries and death, but they serve a purpose and they're not inherently bad in their own right.

[01:40:22] Travis Bader: The people who misuse them and, uh, operate motor vehicles under the influence or inappropriate ways. Yeah. We got to crack down on that. That same sort of connection doesn't seem to be made with. Firearms, because there's an emotional attachment to it. And I see the, the way to move past that is just to highlight the, the individuals, highlight the process, whether that be somebody who's working in remote wilderness areas, I mean, who would want to tell them they can't defend themselves from a predatory animal.

[01:40:58] Travis Bader: If someone's going to eat meat. Okay. Squaring yourself with the fact that at some point an animal has to die in order to do that, hunting is a, I don't think everybody should hunt. I mean, I don't think there's enough room out there if everybody wants to be out hunting, uh, and it's not, it's not for everybody, but those who wish to do it, I think should treat it with the reverence and respect that's required.

[01:41:21] Travis Bader: And that requires you to understand the, the animals and your, what the habitat and the, uh, the flora, the fauna. And your own physical capabilities with, uh, the tools that you, that you bring out with you. So I think that's the biggest thing that we try to get across with Silvercore. It's not yay gun or bad gun.

[01:41:42] Travis Bader: It's just, what is it you're trying to achieve? And firearm just happens to be one part of that. 

[01:41:48] Sabrina Smelko: Yeah. You guys did a great job of that. I, I want to take more courses. That's for sure. 

[01:41:52] Travis Bader: Thank you. Thank you. Alrighty. Is there anything else we should be talking about before we wrap up? 

[01:42:00] Sabrina Smelko: Might be interesting to chat about that viral video.

[01:42:02] Sabrina Smelko: I don't know, or what virality is or something I've been thinking about a lot lately is do brands want to go viral because what that actually means is really interesting. And I've been listening to a lot of podcasts lately and just yesterday there was one with a company who I think their, their company name is.

[01:42:23] Sabrina Smelko: I don't know if it's go viral or viral ish, something like that, but they specialize in creating viral videos and every video they make is viral. It gets millions of views, but they talked about something really interesting, which was that not all. Well, what my takeaway was is that not all brands should want to go viral because in order to go viral, you have to.

[01:42:45] Sabrina Smelko: Invoke a very, very polarized feeling in people and get a very strong emotional reaction. And for a lot of brands, that's just not appropriate. You don't want to like for some brands that are about being harmonious or Zen, you're not going to want a viral video because automatically viral videos, they're that viral because they're polarized.

[01:43:08] Sabrina Smelko: People are posting them because they're pissed at it. They're mad at it. They're happy about it. It's, it's, you're trying to get an emotion out of somebody. And fear is one of the biggest ones that we work on or, or that feeling of suspense, but that's not necessarily. Something that a brand should want, because the value of that might not align with your brand values.

[01:43:29] Sabrina Smelko: So, I find it really interesting that people think they want to go viral, but I don't think it's necessarily appropriate. And it doesn't necessarily give you the audience that you're looking for. It might give you a lot of views, it'll get you a lot of eyeballs, it'll get you a lot of attention. But it's going to be from one off people.

[01:43:45] Sabrina Smelko: It's going to be from people who are reacting to it and sharing it because they reacted, and they know that their followers are going to react like them. But that reaction might not necessarily be positive or, or negative. It might be more personal or emotional and fear based. And I just don't know that that's something every brand should 

[01:44:04] Travis Bader: have.

[01:44:05] Travis Bader: I can see that. Unless it's like a sneezing panda or something that, uh, wakes up the mom. Like there's, there are viral videos out there that they go around that aren't necessarily fear based and everyone's, oh, that's cute. But you're right. Does that bring you an audience that you want? I think the biggest thing that somebody could be looking for more than virality is engagement.

[01:44:24] Travis Bader: And having engagement that's done in a positive way that goes towards whatever that North star of the business has is fantastic. Like I know the formula on the podcast to having greater hits and views. I can look through the metrics and I can see that. Um, we will have special forces people on, and we will highlight keywords and have thumbnails up to kind of click, get them to click into it.

[01:44:52] Travis Bader: Or we will have a politically divisive topics that we can talk about to get people fired up. I mean, sure we can do that, but my goal of this whole podcast anyways, isn't to try and get people fired up once in a while it's important and there's a message that needs to come out, but, uh, by and large, the goal is to bring positivity into their lives.

[01:45:14] Travis Bader: And the people who want to be along for the ride are engaging and they are talking and they're sharing it with other people. Who are, who are like minded. Do I want that to be viral? Well, maybe in so far as I'd like a lot of people, it would be nice to surround yourself with a lot of like minded people who want to work and strive to be better, but in the same breath, having that opposition to it is important just so you can have a, uh, a more balanced approach to what you're doing and you don't end up in that echo chamber.

[01:45:43] Travis Bader: Yeah. 

[01:45:45] Sabrina Smelko: But yeah, the engagement is. Far more important than the views. Absolutely. Especially this day and age. I mean, on half the videos of the brands you follow they hide their likes anyhow, so it's Oh, yeah, you can hide likes you can hide comments it's Very sneaky with it. Okay. I'd say it's pretty common.

[01:46:06] Travis Bader: Yeah. Interesting. Cause I see people and they've got just massive followings and they'll post something and they'll have less likes on it than something that we put up with a fraction of the number, uh, or less engagement on it or posting every single day. And it looks like there's a, there's a huge presence.

[01:46:24] Travis Bader: It's just adding noise, 

[01:46:26] Sabrina Smelko: essentially. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. That's what I think people more than virality, people should be going for that word, the engagement and the community and keeping that community because viral can mean those people go away. Um, but when you have an engaged community of followers, the people already following you, if they are.

[01:46:45] Sabrina Smelko: Looking at your stuff because it's educational enough, that's, that is true virality more for me, where you have someone who's willing to listen and who opens your newsletter when they get sent it, as opposed to, ah, that was just a crazy video of a panda, LOL, you know? 

[01:46:59] Travis Bader: Well, how do you, how do you build community and how do you maintain community?

[01:47:02] Travis Bader: What are the biggest keys that somebody would be looking for? 

[01:47:06] Sabrina Smelko: I think you actually said it really well when you were talking about giving speeches or talks. Um, I think it was when I was asked, I asked you about being comfortable public speaking and you said you felt comfortable when you were educating or thinking of someone in the audience as one person and trying to think of the value you could give that one person.

[01:47:24] Sabrina Smelko: And I think that's how people should think about their Instagram or social media as well is the way to get the most engagement is to just speak to one person and make it relevant. For that person. And the easiest way to do that is making it relevant for yourself because there's other people who think like you.

[01:47:41] Sabrina Smelko: There's probably hundreds of thousands of people who might have that similar thought as you. So I think just appealing to yourself and appealing to that one person. Don't try and please the demographic of 20 to 40 or you know. Female and male, let's find like, what is the common denominator? Just speak to one person, the one person who's probably the most like you, the person who's probably the most like what you want to hear and share about is that relatability.

[01:48:09] Sabrina Smelko: Cause if you are inauthentic and you're sharing something, that's not you or you don't care about, people can pick that up in a heartbeat. Right? Is there 

[01:48:18] Travis Bader: a pitfall? Cause I've thought about this a lot, like originally building Silvercore, wanted it separate from myself. And we spoke about that earlier, but the pitfall of always having the same face, the same person, the same, the person becoming the brand, uh, As is there a pitfall for scalability and sustainability?

[01:48:42] Travis Bader: I don't think so. 

[01:48:43] Sabrina Smelko: No, no, I don't. Because think about a person. We're so unique and so rich with so much story and so many things. You could tell a new story tomorrow that someone will relate to. That they've never heard before, but it's still familiar to them. 'cause there's some kind of recognition, oh, I had a similar upbringing or a similar experience.

[01:49:05] Sabrina Smelko: Hmm. I don't think it's, it's, I think a person is so unending and that's why I think an individual, being a single person as a brand, I think there's totally opportunity to grow. I've seen many single influencers, I guess is one of the biggest spaces I see a lot in where it starts as one person, then they end up creating a, a clothing line or, or, Cosmetic company or something.

[01:49:28] Sabrina Smelko: And that passion it's still from them. There's still the spokesperson for it, but you can still grow a team. You can still do other things. Yeah. I don't think it's a mistake to, you know, you can name yourself a fun pseudonym. So if you don't want to call yourself Travis, but you're still Travis, you're still, it's still you individually as a brand.

[01:49:48] Sabrina Smelko: It's all of your interests and all of the offshoots, but it still comes down to, if you were removed from Silvercore, would it still be kept going? Probably by Tiff, because she's awesome, but you know what I mean, like it's still, it's you, it's you as an individual is the brand, it just happens to not be called your name, it just happens to be called something else.

[01:50:09] Sabrina Smelko: But everything that you explore, everything you talk about, everything you share and teach is your passion, your interests. Otherwise it wouldn't exist. 

[01:50:17] Travis Bader: Interesting perspective. Cause I've always looked at it on the other side, that it would be nice to have something that can grow independent of you. If you were out of it, does the whole thing fall apart?

[01:50:27] Travis Bader: And that's, that was my original endeavor with Silvercore. And I spent about 20 years doing that, moving down that path till I finally realized. Okay, I'm going to have to, I'm going to have to share a bit more about myself and I'm going to have to interject and make it clear for people what it is, what our mission is and why we're working in a certain way.

[01:50:48] Travis Bader: So we can attract the right kind of people, the people who are supposed to be along the ride with you on this one. Yeah. 

[01:50:56] Sabrina Smelko: And it will live past you only because. You've recognized that it is you, and it would be your interests, passions, and things that you've packaged is the legacy of it. Like, after you leave, should your children or something decide to continue it, I still think that you are the individual at the heart of it.

[01:51:13] Sabrina Smelko: Just because you've gone and passed doesn't mean anything. Your legacy, your individual ness, is still why that brand exists. So, yeah, as a single individual, I mean, that's, that's... That's it. You can be whatever you want. Every single company even. We watched a documentary last night about Nike and the founders and all of that story.

[01:51:34] Sabrina Smelko: And it's funny to still think that it's still just these individual people at the end of the day. You know, it still lives without them. It's a legacy. It's Nike. Everyone knows about it. If he passes away, it still continues. But I still attribute that brand is only there because one individual gave enough of a crap to make it.

[01:51:52] Sabrina Smelko: That was, I think of it still as a person. 

[01:51:55] Travis Bader: It was Phil Knight. I think I read his book shoe dog sometime ago. First half of the book, I think was well, uh, a bit more thought out than the second half of the book. But, um, uh. Yeah, he seems like 

[01:52:06] Sabrina Smelko: an interesting guy. 

[01:52:08] Travis Bader: Totally interesting guy. And the one thing that was surprising was just how, pardon the pun, but he was operating on a shoestring budget for almost the entirety of Nike's career.

[01:52:18] Travis Bader: For the majority of the time when they were presenting so big. And they look like they're just a force to be reckoned with and he is just scraping things by and, and then his legal troubles that he had later on where, where he was able to win. That was, that was, I thought that was an interesting part of the battle, the, uh, um, how the, uh, judicial system in the, um, the government just tried to hammer down on him and lost essentially.

[01:52:44] Travis Bader: Oh, interesting. Huh? 

[01:52:45] Sabrina Smelko: I don't know if they talked about that. I never got to that part of it. No, it wasn't in the movie. What was interesting was the movie. It's kind of sort of around what we're talking about. It's all about getting Michael Jordan and signing him. Um, and that was so revolutionary at the time.

[01:53:01] Sabrina Smelko: And it makes me think back to like these people who are just willing to do things a little differently and be a little innovative. There was just a guy who worked there named Sonny. I forget what his position was, but he was basically like the basketball division. And it was the most unsuccessful thing.

[01:53:16] Sabrina Smelko: Nike was like, had 17% of the market. Converse had 23. Adidas had like, Nike was like the crappy brand, like no one bought Nike, it was Adidas and Converse. And basketball was like the big way that they marketed themselves and every single company would hire two, three, four different basketball players to promote their shoes.

[01:53:39] Sabrina Smelko: And you know, you give them each 50 grand for a total of the 250, 000 for the year for your marketing budget with these guys. And it doesn't seem novel now, but at the time, Sonny, who worked at Nike, was like, No one's gonna want to sign with us. We're the crappy company. Instead of offering all these low picks, like the, you know, getting player number 10, 11, and 12, why don't we go for number one?

[01:54:03] Sabrina Smelko: Why don't we sign Michael Jordan? But we'll only do that if we pool all of the money that we would have given all the other athletes, we work with him a little bit better, and Sonny specifically. was just saw something in Michael Jordan. He saw his potential and he saw that he was an innovative player.

[01:54:19] Sabrina Smelko: He saw that he was going to be something and he just believed in him. And so they offered him the contract and he ended up obviously signing with Nike and it ended up being the most successful deal in the world of both the Jordans and Nike. And, and the whole point of it was he signed with the 1% of getting 1% of the revenue from every shoe sold.

[01:54:41] Sabrina Smelko: And just thinking about that being new back then, now it's pretty normal for athletes or artists or whatever to get a royalty percentage. But this was only 30, 40 years ago. It wasn't that long ago. It's just, it's not that long ago. And whenever I hear these stories, it inspires me for other people to start their own things.

[01:55:00] Sabrina Smelko: Or just be inventive or think of a different way to do it. Like... That was crazy for Sonny at the time to offer them 1% of it, like, they thought the board members and all the people at the table of Nike were gonna say no, and... But that's what ended up making their whole business. And it was just that wild ass idea.

[01:55:18] Sabrina Smelko: Like having a little bit of a side idea and a little bit of a passion, just seeing something and doing it a different way. Like it wasn't the normal thing is find three athletes, get three of them, three commercials. It's not that crazy innovative to say, what about just one? Well, where do you see the fact 

[01:55:35] Travis Bader: then it was, what do you see the future of social media and social marketing?

[01:55:42] Travis Bader: Is AI going to take over? 

[01:55:44] Sabrina Smelko: No, gosh, no. I think I, I love AI actually, which might be a funny thing to say because it could kind of replace a lot of my jobs, but I see it as the perfect count, uncreative counterpart. Personally, I feel like I have so many ideas. The creativity is just kind of overwhelming and I find AI so helpful for the fact side of things and To a previous podcast guest you had on.

[01:56:13] Sabrina Smelko: Hmm. He talked about how you can never replace human creativity and innovation. Hmm. And I think when you combine your thoughts and creativity and ideas with a tool like I AI that could help you come up with a framework for something fast, or write a business plan fast or do something fast, I think the more that we use these kind of technologies and tools, the faster that you can make use of your creativity because you're, it's gonna spawn things and you're gonna think of stuff and.

[01:56:39] Sabrina Smelko: It's not good. When you tell it to write an Instagram caption, it's a piece of crap. It's not good. But, it might say a word, or it might pair two words, or it might bring up a new way of saying something that makes you think differently. So I like using AI as like an inspiration tool to like, to trigger me, almost.

[01:56:57] Sabrina Smelko: If I use it enough and I give it enough prompts and I use it in the right ways, it's gonna help my mind and my creativity and my imagination sort itself out a little bit better. So I think it's positive because I think the combination of what it can do with our innovation and creativity and the fact that it doesn't have that side, I think it's pretty cool.

[01:57:19] Sabrina Smelko: So I think the future would be that everybody is... Kind of, it's like going back in time and in the future at once where I think everyone's gonna be a service person, kind of Like back in Pilgrim times where there's gonna be the, not necessarily a blacksmith and a baker Maybe it's gonna be more like, maybe Like I just, I kind of see that returning a little bit where everyone has an individual gift and skill and we're all just gonna Contribute that to the world And we can all swap those services.

[01:57:45] Sabrina Smelko: We can work with each other. I just think with social media, yeah, like you, you don't have to have a big shop or retail store e commerce site. You could just offer facts. You could just offer a service. You could just offer, I bake this and I show you how to do it. It's just, I see social media. I think it's so positive because it can help us share skills and grow skills and promote our skills.

[01:58:11] Sabrina Smelko: So that's what I'm excited to use it for. And I've always seen the glass half full though, on social media, whenever people are negative about it, I tend to question them a little 

[01:58:21] Travis Bader: bit. All it is, is a mirror. What you're seeing is what, what you've been looking at. 

[01:58:26] Sabrina Smelko: Exactly. Yep. So if you don't like your social, you're following it, but your feed sucks.

[01:58:30] Sabrina Smelko: Like follow better people, you know, totally get, get inspired, use it for fun and back to being in, having enjoyment in life and having fun with it. It can be a place that's positive for you. If you curate it to 

[01:58:43] Travis Bader: be, well, what I'm going to do is I'm going to put some links in the bio. So anybody who wants to learn more about you can click on that and they can find out more about what you do.

[01:58:53] Travis Bader: Sabrina. Thank you so much for being on the Silvercore podcast and all the work and help you've provided in the past. Really appreciate it. Oh, 

[01:59:01] Sabrina Smelko: thank you so much for having me. I appreciate you taking the time and I'm sure I could have talked for another few hours with you, but we got to wrap 

[01:59:08] Travis Bader: somewhere. I love it.

[01:59:09] Travis Bader: We'll do that too. Take care.