Silvercore Podcast Ep. 169: How OnX Changed Hunting Forever with Dylan Dowson

Silvercore Podcast 169 Dylan dowson === [00:00:00] Travis Bader: Today's guest works with on X, a premier hunting navigation tool that you can download on your phone, use on your computer, and if you're a Silvercore Club member, you've already heard him share some of his insider tips on the outpost. He's talked about some of the biggest lessons he's learned in the field. Mistakes new hunters should avoid how to handle pressure on public land, and even his go-to advice for how to prepare for backcountry hunts. If you are a member and you haven't tuned into the outpost yet, you're missing out, log into Silver core.ca, go to your club portal and you can download your personal podcast link. If you're not a member, head over to silver core.ca. We can learn how you can join the Silver Core Club and get access to exclusive content like this and [00:01:00] all of the other member perks. Now, one last thing before we get rolling with this podcast. If you enjoy listening to this Silver Core podcast and you want to see it grow, I'm gonna ask you to do me a huge favor. Take a screenshot of a review that you've left for this Silver Core Podcast on Apple Podcasts or on Spotify. Send it on in to info@silvercore.ca with your mailing address, and I'm gonna send you a free Silver Core sticker. As a thank you. Now, without further ado, let's get on with this podcast. He grew up in the wide open country of eastern Montana, chasing adventure with his dad and building a lifelong passion for hunting. Today, he channels that same passion into his work with On X, where he spent nearly a decade helping shape the way hunters connect with the land through technology and storytelling. From epic hunts to his role in OnX leading Western big game marketing, his work has left a lasting mark on the hunting [00:02:00] community. Welcome to the Silver Corp podcast, Dylan Dowson. [00:02:05] Dylan Dowson: Thank you. Thanks for, uh, thank you for the introduction. That was a heck of an introduction, and thank you for, uh, for having me on. It's always good to, good to talk a little hunting, and, uh, especially this time of year, I'm, I'm excited that it's coming Quick. [00:02:17] Travis Bader: Yeah, we're gearing up, aren't we? Well, it was, it was Joe Appel friend of mine in the Squamish area who actually put me on to you and onto on X. 'cause uh, prior to that it was something that I'd kinda looked at and I thought, ah, this is only for Americans. And, uh, being a Canadian, what has this got to do for me? And well, sure enough, you guys are in Canada too, and it works amazing. And you got some pretty cool features that are, uh, that are kind of fun. But, um, well let, let's get this thing kind of rolling. Why don't you tell me a little bit about what got you into the outdoor space and into OnX, and then we can start sharing some hunting adventures. [00:02:54] Dylan Dowson: Yeah, I love it. Um, like you said in the intro, I, I grew up in Eastern Montana. [00:03:00] Where hunting and fishing and just the outdoor lifestyle in general is, it's easy to get into. Right? I am very fortunate and blessed that I did not grow up in an area that there was strong barriers to get into it. I mean, heck, I've shot some, some of my best animals within five, 10 miles from, from the town I grew up in. So there wasn't a big barrier of entry of like, yeah, you gotta, you know, apply for these tags and then if you get them you can go hunting. It was just like something, something we just did. Right. It was a way of life. Uh, and that's, that's what I grew up doing and very, very fortunate to do that. But yeah, Eastern Montana, I mean, primarily over there. I grew up mul, deer, whitetail hunting, um, antelope hunting as well. And then I, I kind of cut my teeth on elk hunting. Shoot, I was probably 11, 12, the first elk hunt that I went on. Um, and just right away was hooked, right? Like. The age old question, if you could pick one animal, what would it be? For me, it would have to be elk with a bow in my hand. [00:04:00] Um, pretty, pretty tough to beat that. I still remember the day that I heard my very first beagle, and it was one of those mornings that was just like chaos and just magical that you, you strive for every year. And I mean, that night I heard my first bugle and I think I heard my a hundred 50th bugle in that same night. Just crazy, crazy evening. So anyways, uh, needless to say, I was beyond hooked on, on elk hunting specifically. But uh, yeah, I grew up in my hunting. When I grew up it was pretty secluded to Eastern Montana, you know, if it wasn't, you know, two, three hour drive for an elk hunt, it was right close to home base. And now one of the things, you know, as I have expanded and especially working with Onyx and the opportunities that's brought me to hunt other states. Uh, to come up into Canada a few different times. Um, Alaska did Hawaii this year, went down to Mexico this year. Hunt KZ deer. I mean, just my, my hunting has expanded from, okay. Montana has a lot of really [00:05:00] cool opportunities to, you know, we have some of the tools even to draw, you know, whether it's draw odds and application stuff for all the other states. Like, I now have the, the tools and the means and, and the drive, I guess I would call it, to apply to other states and to hunt new species and to hunt new areas and stuff. So, um, yeah, it's been, it's been a pretty wild ride. Um, actually just about a week ago, I crossed my 10 years working here at OnX, so a lot has changed in the last 10 years of OnX. When I started, it was relatively small company, um, you know, 20, 30 folks that worked here and now it's, uh, it's really blown up and has, uh, a ton of employees and. We're do, we're able to do cool things now, like be in Canada, right? Um mm-hmm. We found a, a need for folks in, in the States and we're like, we can find some, some data for Canada and provide that product and, and, uh, whatnot to you guys, our, our good friends up north. So yeah, it's, it's been a pretty cool, pretty cool decade working here at [00:06:00] OnX and, and getting to do some awesome things. [00:06:03] Travis Bader: Well, what do you think the secret to the OnX growth has been? Has marketing and storytelling been an, an integral part of that? [00:06:10] Dylan Dowson: It really has. Yeah. And, uh, when I started, actually, I started out in customer service. It was like the job opening at the time, and, and I took it, right? So I was the, the single person on the phones. Emails. There was like one other guy that would help out when we got real busy, but there's a good chance, you know, if somebody had bought the chip or at that stage, the, the app on the phone was very early. Um, if they had questions or anything, I was a person they were talking to back in the day. So, um, you know, I wasn't always on the marketing side, but needless to say, I say that because you know how much we've expanded from that day. We had one customer service rep at the time. Now we hire a bunch of seasonal help as well, but I don't know, it's probably 40 plus folks just in customer service. Um, wow. And, and yeah, I think part of that is that the marketing and storytelling and, [00:07:00] you know, the adoption of the product, but a big part of that is just the flywheel of, you know, I, I give it a try, right? If you and I are hunting buddies and I try something that is, you know, very, very impactful in, in the way that I hunt and it lets me go hunt new areas and you see that as my hunting buddy and I'm either a gonna be like, Hey. You have to download this because I'm trying to send you a way point, um, you know, to where we're gonna meet up at this trailhead in the dark that you've never been to and without this way point, you know, it's gonna be chaos without cell service. Um mm-hmm. All the way to, you know, maybe I go on a hunt in a different area and find success and like, how did you go find that spot? I tell you, OnX, you download it, you tell three friends, they tell three friends. And, and it really has just kind of created that flywheel of, um, you know, 10 years, 10 years ago. A lot of folks still use the product and, and relied on it. But today it's kind of becoming one of those things where I'm [00:08:00] going hunting. I need my, my rifle and my boots and my orange and I better have my onyx downloaded. 'cause if not, it's gonna be a, a pretty tough hunt. [00:08:09] Travis Bader: You know, I, I love technology. I love learning new things as they come out, but I'm also torn because I love doing things in an old fashioned way. I still carry a map and compass with me on my hunts, and I, I, I look at the features that OnX has, and I know I'm only scratching the surface on all the different things it does. Uh, I, I like, I like when I'm driving to a location and I see areas that look good, that it's right up there on my CarPlay. I can just whoop, press the thing and then check it out for right off. It tells me, yeah. Or I can download the maps, which I don't wanna sound like a, a shill for OnX here. But I'm just gonna tell you the boat, the things I'm, uh, excited about. I like how fast it will download maps, uh, high resolution, high quality maps. And a lot of the areas, most of the areas that I hunt, I don't have cell reception, so I want that [00:09:00] stuff downloaded and I can see that all up on my vehicle if I'm driving into a location or if I'm on the side by side or a quad or that I get on out, uh, there's one, uh, piece that I think OnX can do. I'm not a hundred percent sure I've heard of it. I've never used it, but if you down an animal and you can see it, there it is over there. It's like I shot, it's in that direction and it kind of bogeyed off and I'm pretty sure it's, it's dyed over somewhere over here. But if I laser it, it can show up with certain laser devices. If I do a range find, it can show up on my, uh, app and show me how to get there. Is that, is that fact or fiction? [00:09:38] Dylan Dowson: Yeah, no. That, that is fact. We work, uh, right now with a couple different companies and uh, got some other ones coming out soon. But essentially right now loophole in six hour, uh, we work with those range finding devices that have Bluetooth. Essentially, yeah, you can, you can pin on your map using those. Um, and there's other ways of doing it, right? There's, we have a [00:10:00] compass mode within the hunt app to where if you tap your location twice, it puts you in what we call compass mode. And then it has a range finder tool. So even if you don't have a capable range finder to connect with that, um, any range finder, right? So I can range something and say, that's where I saw that, that animal, after the shot run into the trees. I, I know right where it is, but as soon as I lose visual, as soon as I lose elevation to get up to that other side, I'm not gonna be able to see that anymore. And I think we've all done this, right? It's like, I, I know exactly where that bull is standing. I know where that bear was standing. I'm just, I'm excited. I'm just gonna go, I just shot it. I'm excited. We waited, you know, six days, just had it. I'm gonna go find it right now. I'm pumped up. And then you get up there and you start scratching your head, it's like, was it here? Was it here? Mm-hmm. Am I a hundred yards away from where it was? Am I two yards away from where it was? Everything looks different. You know that specific bush and tree? Mm-hmm. From across the canyon that you pinpointed and you haven ant etched in your brain. You get [00:11:00] up there, it doesn't look like the same bush and tree all of a sudden. So, um, essentially, yeah, you can put your phone into compass mode and long-winded way of saying it, but you can arrange it and say it's, you know, 327 yards away. Well then in the app, I can orient my phone in compass mode and turn right in, line up that area and type in 327 yards and it will drop away. Point you can drop away point 327 yards from your location. Lined up exactly in that direction, um, with that bearing. So now you're, you're, you've got a way point, right? You still need to go up there and do your due due diligence. Can't just walk right to the way point, and you're a hundred percent accurate a hundred percent of the time, but I'm telling you, it will put you within a couple feet or a yard or two from where you want to be. So, um, that's huge. You can do it through, yeah, through the app. And then also again, uh, that loophole, the, and sig, you know, you can also just Bluetooth to it and, and do it that way as well, [00:11:56] Travis Bader: huh. All right. Well, my, my wife's using the sig. I'm gonna have to see if she's [00:12:00] got the Bluetooth model and, uh, see how that works. And, um, the kilos, I think is what she got. I've got, uh, Leicas and I've been, been working on Leica to see if, if they'll, uh, trade mine in for their new Bluetooth version. But, uh, so far no luck, but we'll see. We'll see what we can do there. [00:12:17] Dylan Dowson: There we go. Yeah, we, uh, we're, we're in conversations with Leica as well, and, uh, yeah, excited about some of the stuff that, that we're able to do there. And, um. Yeah, it just goes to show that the technology too and, and letting the technology expand. 10 years ago when I first started working here, there's that just that technology wouldn't have existed. Right? It didn't exist. So it was impossible to add features like that today. You know, we, we've got that capability and it's also one of those things too, where just because you can do something doesn't necessarily mean you should. Um, you know, to your point there with technology and where it's going, there's some, some things that we probably could do that we are going, you know, have chosen and are going to choose not to [00:13:00] do, right? At the end of the day, we, we love getting outdoors, we love hunting, we love the pursuit. And if we ever get to a point where it almost becomes too easy because of technology allows it to, you know, there's, there's some areas for barriers there. Um, and that's just a good conversation to, to keep having. Right. And whether it's you. Long range hunting or you know, you name it. Some of the gear we have now really allows us to be a lot more successful and stay out there longer and shoot further and, and whatever. And technology. And, and these right here, your cell phones are, uh, another piece of that conversation that we continually have here at Onyx. [00:13:38] Travis Bader: Yeah, that, that was where I was gonna go with this too. Uh, do you get many, I mean, there's always gonna be people, especially in the hunting firearms world. Well, you're not a hunter. You use quads. You gotta use a quads. God gave you, well you're not a hunter 'cause you use a rifle. I use a bow. Or I'm a musket. I'm a muzzle loader. Yeah. There's always gonna be those things and there's gonna [00:14:00] be the naysayers. Do you get much heat from people saying, nah, nah, nah, this, this technology's making an unfair for hunters. [00:14:08] Dylan Dowson: We get more heat from, I'll call it spot burning. Than we do for technology. Um, not to say, and I, again, I'm not really on this side of the business anymore with customer service. I'm sure that there's been folks that have reached out and said, Hey, I don't like this feature. I think this is crossing the line, or et cetera, et cetera. Um, but yeah, we, we get more heat from, Hey, I had this amazing honey hole before OnX because I was the only one that did the research to get back in this one piece of public using this age old easement. And now with OnX, everybody knows about it, right? We, we get more of that, um, which I totally understand, right? Like we, we've got our spots, I've got my spots, I like going and I don't like running into other hunters. And, um, a hundred percent, you know, that's fair. And we, we recognize that and kind of our, [00:15:00] not rebuttal to get into an argument about it, but our. You know, our conversation back is like, well, how many new spots have you found because of vnx? Right? Like, sure, you might have that one spot that, you know, there's a couple other hunters that know about how to legally get in there now and hunt successfully. But what about all the other spots that you found because of it? And, and usually folks are like, yeah, okay. That's actually a good point. I've got, you know, I just hunted a brand new state that would've been really hard to do without the tool. So, um, yeah, there's, there's, you know, pros and, and cons to, to some of that, and we, we absolutely recognize that. But honestly, it's, it's so small. The, the feedback that we get like that it is, uh, you know, a percentage of the percentage of folks that, that feel that way. And, uh, usually we get the stories of like, man, you gotta look at this picture of this buck. Like, I, I took my kid hunting for the first time in a new state. Like there's no way possible without OnX that we would've been able to shoot this buck and, and that type of stuff. So it's overwhelmingly positive, uh, responses. But [00:16:00] yeah, we, we recognize, you know, with uh. I, I'll say it this way, with great power comes great responsibility with technology and uh, um, yeah, continuing to have that conversation. That's one thing that I've been proud about, you know, working at Onyx is, um, having those conversations and making sure that, you know, we, we feel good about what we are doing and that the much more important larger scale, you know, system of, of the hunting industry that we, we happen to work in. [00:16:28] Travis Bader: So a friend of mine called up says Trav got a general open season hunt here in bc. It's something that I found this area I've hunted with my family and this year, uh, we're not able to get the family members up for whatever reason, still want to go. I'd love if you'd come up and join me with it. This is gonna be for an elk hunt, so of course I said yes a hundred percent. Absolutely I will. Um, being somebody who has a passion for elk hunting. Being somebody who works for OnX who [00:17:00] can provide some tips and tidbits, what sort of advice would you give me if you wanted to see me or anybody else out there successful on a northern British Columbia elk hunt? And what sort of things would you be relying on or use utilizing with the OnX app to, uh, to help in that success? [00:17:20] Dylan Dowson: Yeah, yeah, that's a, that's a great question. The, the thing I'll start off by saying there is how I use the Hunt app and how you use the Hunt app are going to be entirely different. And that, the cool thing about the, the tool itself is it's just a tool, right? Same thing as a, a bow or a rifle. You know, if you go, if you, if we are rifle hunting and we both get the brand new long range fancy Leica optic on top and all this fancy stuff, and you go shoot it and learn it and, you know, figure out the dope on it and practice with it. I don't, I zero it at a hundred yards the day before season. You're gonna be a lot more efficient [00:18:00] with that tool than I am, right? So it, at the end of the day, it's, it's a tool. And there there is some, I'll call it, practicing with it just like you would with a rifle or breaking in a new pair of boots before a hunt. Um, that is, I wouldn't say required, but it's very helpful to be more successful. Um, so I guess that's a little bit preseason going into it. I would say if, if somebody hasn't really explored the app and, and know it's ins and outs, which most folks don't, to your point, you know, you, you feel like you haven't scratched the surface. And I will say, I've said this for a long time, that this is, I don't have data to back this statement up at all, but I feel like 90% of Onyx users use less than 10% of its capability. Most folks out there are just using it to see, okay, where am I at on the map? I might mark a waypoint where the truck is so I can find it if I get lost. And that's about it. And the cool thing is, is they're still finding enough value in that to subscribe and, and [00:19:00] still be loyal, you know, customers of ours, but they're so much more to it. And the biggest thing I tell folks is to get in there and practice. Like, heck, last night I was laying in bed and I'm ESC scouting for this coming weekend where I'm gonna go put some boots on the ground in some new country for a, a rifle elk permit that my wife drew. Um, but essentially my point there is like, if you're laying in bed at night or sitting on the couch or. Sitting at an airport and you've got a couple hours, get in OnX and just tap all the buttons. See what they do. You're not gonna break it. People are so afraid with technology, they're gonna break it. But get in there, tap the buttons, turn the layers on, turn the layers off. See what that does to your maps. See how you are going to find the most value in it. And, and that's step one, right? Just tap the buttons, see what they do. Mark away point, change the color on it, add notes to it, add a photo to that way point, text it to your buddy. Just see how that works. So when you get out there in the field, you're [00:20:00] not, you know, when you get out there, the last thing you want to do is spend a ton of time on your phone anyways, right? Mm-hmm. You wanna use the tool to be successful, but you don't want to learn OnX while you're on a hunt. You've got better things to do. You're out there to hunt. So learn it before would be my first thing, and, and tap those buttons and share waypoints and do all that. Fun, fun, cool stuff. Um, and then definitely save a few offline maps, which you alluded to. A lot of folks don't, you know, realize that maybe where they're going, they don't have service or whatnot. But, uh, regardless, even if you're not a hundred percent sure, just save a few maps, you can save multiple maps on top of it. So you could save a giant area. For example, I've got the entire state of Montana saved on my phone in low resolution maps, so it doesn't take up a ton of storage because there's a lot of areas in Montana I don't need saved. But I want to make sure that anywhere I go, I've got a map, I can see what's private, what's public. I can see my location, I can like get [00:21:00] a map, and then the areas that I specifically know I'm going to go in and hunt. Then I will dive into those areas, whether it be an entire unit, a mountain range, a general area, and I'll save medium or high resolution maps there. So the reason that you don't just save the entire, you know, state of Montana or a large chunk of area in high res maps is that it just eats up a lot of storage on your phone. [00:21:23] Travis Bader: Mm. If you [00:21:23] Dylan Dowson: have the storage, great, go for it. Um, but if you don't need to be able to zoom in really tight on the imagery and see like, oh, that's a rock outcropping with a tree on the right side, like very, very specific detailed imagery, um, you can get away with the low res maps and then go in and saved medium or high where you are going specifically. So then once I cross over that border of that saved map, now I can zoom in really tight. I've got like the best imagery saved. I've got all the, you know, everything I need there. So learn it, save maps off on use. And then, um, as far as layers and stuff, that's where we really get [00:22:00] into how I use it and how you use it are going to be different. One of the layers, for example, that excuse me, I really like is slope angle layer. So you turn on slope angle layer and it kind of, it, it. Changes the colors on your map, and at first it can be a little overwhelming. Uh, you got red, so you got greens, you got blues, and it's like just a, a color vomit on your map all of a sudden. But you look at the top and there's a scale bar and it'll tell you what that color gradient is. And so this is really helpful for identifying, um, benches and saddles and just if you're going up through a Cliffy mountain, for example, it will identify better than almost anything else, your best path to hike to the top of the mountain and not get cliffed out. Um, so think of it like a topo map or lidar, but more, almost more detailed and based on past hunts. I know like we, we did a spring bear hunt a [00:23:00] couple years ago in Idaho and we packed out two bears out of a canyon and with the slope angle turned on, there was a lot of purple involved in our hike up in purple. I now know having been in it is like hands and feet, like you're, you're grabbing onto trees above you to pull you up the mountain essentially. Um, and so especially when you look at way points and have, when you've been in areas that you know what it was like to come outta that canyon, and then you look at slope angle and it's like, okay, now I start to understand, you know, we want to stay in this area. Or if there's little blotches of purple, uh, and blue mixed within that mountain. Those are generally cliffy areas where you will get clipped out. If you look at a topo map and even three DA lot of times you don't see those little cliffy pockets where, you know, if you're coming out heavy or in the dark with a headlamp and it's raining and it's slippery. You want to just avoid those at all costs, right? And the slope angle layer can really help you depict that and help, help A, find navigation routes for [00:24:00] you. B, find navigation routes for the game you're pursuing. And c you know, little things like benches and, uh, you know, I've, I've used it to find water before on the side of a mountain and all that good stuff. So that's one example of, uh, you know, a layer, a piece of data that I like using. Now you might use it and be like, nah, it, that's not really helpful for me. But what is helpful for me is, uh, you know, using Terrain X on the desktop beforehand and, and finding like north facing stuff between 15 and 22 degrees, um, between this elevation band, right? Like, there's so many things that you as a hunter are gonna approach it differently than I am. And again, it just goes back to the tool and, you know, what's, what is your method of hunting? Too, because if I like calling in bulls and you like stocking into them, or spot and stalking, like we we're probably gonna use the, the tool a little bit different, um, you know, for those different use cases of hunting. So hopefully [00:25:00] that answered your question a little bit. It was kind of a long-winded way of, there's a lot to it and, uh mm-hmm. [00:25:04] Travis Bader: You know, [00:25:04] Dylan Dowson: everybody's gonna use it differently. There's not really a cheat code. Right. I think a lot of times with, with OnX, people want to say like, what do I need to do to use it to be successful and what's the cheat code? And, and there's not just like, there's no cheat code of okay, you just bought a fancy rifle with a high dollar liquor on top, and that doesn't mean you can go shoot an animal at seven, 800 yards out of the box. Mm-hmm. Um, nor should you, so there's, uh, yeah, there's, you, you kind of get out of it what you put into it. And that is to, again, circling back to the folks that are like, oh, OnX just makes this easier for everybody. It's like, well if you're, if you're really passionate about your hunting and you want to learn and be more successful. You can use it to be successful, but it's, uh, just because you download the the OnX ONTAP does not mean everybody's on the, the same level playing field with, with maps and how they use 'em, you know? [00:25:57] Travis Bader: So if we were to take OnX outta the picture and you [00:26:00] wanted to provide some, let's say, elk specific tips that suit your style of hunting, what would you suggest to somebody going out, uh, if they wanted to be successful for elk? [00:26:12] Dylan Dowson: Are you thinking, uh, archery or rifle or rut? Rifle, I guess I should call it rifle. So I primarily, I will just say firsthand, I've shot three Cal Elk with a rifle. I've not shot a single bull with a rifle. 'cause archery elk is like, kind of my, my thing. Hmm. I like hunting them in the rut. So all of my bull elk have been, uh. With a bow and then rifle. Once rifle season happens, I kind of transition to deer antelope and stuff. So I don't have a ton of rifle elk hunting experience besides filling the freezer with some cow elk. Um, but I guess, you know, rot hunting in general, I'll say that. 'cause your guys' rifle, does it start pretty early? Can you rifle hunt during the rut? Yep. Yeah, so perfect. Um, how I have found my success in elk hunting during the rut [00:27:00] is it's a little bit dependent on the, the country, right? I grew up in eastern Montana. There's elk over there in pockets, like it's open, more open terrain. There's timber, but it's not like, you know, a dark black wall of timber, for example. Now I live in western Montana where I'm looking out my window to some pretty rugged mountains. Yeah, there's some open parks and whatnot, but primarily like there's a lot of timber in mountainous country. So. If I'm in mountainous timbered country, I love calling in elk like it is, I, I just love it, right? It might not be the most successful way, the best way to kill a bull on that particular day, but I really love that rush of playing that cat and mouse and having a bull cut me off and scream at my face while he is tending his cows. And like, there's nothing that beats that feeling to me. So that's how I choose to hunt elk. Um, over here where there's [00:28:00] timber is I like to find them. I like to locate 'em, and a lot of times what I'm doing there is covering country at night, whether in the vehicle or on foot or just sitting and listening to different basins at night just to get a, a gauge for it. There's a bull in this drainage. I can hunt him tomorrow. I, I, I hate nothing more than hunting in the morning and not knowing if there's elk in the area. I'd rather be up a lot the night before and hear a bugle and be like, Hey, there's a bull there. I know I'm at least in the game. Tomorrow morning, because I know there's a bull in this area. Um, so again, I, I spend a lot of time in the evenings and at night or getting up very early to, to hear a bugle. So I'm, I'm hunting elk. I'm not just hunting, right? I, I know there's a bull there that I can go after. I'm either gonna screw it up or kill him, but at least there's an outcome hunting. So, uh, yeah, locating him is big for me. And then also after that, again, calling him bulls. Like I love [00:29:00] getting in close, challenging him when you can and, and having that bull upset and coming in mad is, there's nothing cooler, but depending on how fired up he is, if he has cows or not, you know, I, I'm using calling techniques or having, hopefully a buddy calling, uh, a little ways behind me to, to suck in a bull and have a close encounter. Like, that's how I cut my teeth out cu my very first bull. Called him in. My uncle called him in for me. To like six or seven yards max. And he turned broadside and screamed. And it was like, I still remember that, that noise. Wow. That close to me as I was at full draw and I shot him at like six yards. Um, wow. Yeah. It was just like the, and actually that bull is right here next to me. One of, you know, just a great mountain timber bowl. Like it was, that hunt was amazing. Uh, so anytime I'm in the, the mountains in, in the timber, I, I just prefer to call them in because it's more fun for me. Um, transitioning a little bit to, you [00:30:00] know, east more eastern Montana style hunting or just more planes hunting, right? Like, it's not dedicated to Eastern Montana, but it's a little bit more open country. It's breaky. It's craggy. There's timber pockets, but it's not like deep dark timber in the mountains. I have found way more success in that country located in elk. Letting him, and sometimes I try to get him talking. Last year I killed a bull and um, I, I found him the night before. I glass him up the night before. So I went in there. I knew there was an elk in the area, he had cows. And I went in there and, uh, it was just silent that morning. Not a peep, nothing going on. And I'm sitting there and I'm like, I need to know where he is before I commit to, to getting in there so he doesn't, you know, win me. And I don't blow it before I even start it. Hmm. So I bugled he responded. I'm like, okay, I got him. I know where he is. And then we, we kind of did that for another four or five times. I would cover a hundred yards, 200 yards and sit. 'cause at the, you know, [00:31:00] I don't know if they're coming toward me. I don't know what they're doing. And so I'd sit there for a while, nothing. So I'd, I'd bugle again. He, he would respond. I'm like, okay, I got 'em now. I'd move another two, 300 yards. Sit, wait, nothing. So we kind of did that until I got close enough that it made him mad. And then he started bugling a lot on his own. Once he started bugling a lot on his own. I just shut up. I didn't, didn't cow call, didn't beagle. And as long as he was giving up his location, all I was doing was making sure the wind was right and slipping in. And that's how I've killed probably the last five or six bulls is letting them talk and just slipping in and, you know, without any of the elk knowing you're there. 'cause there's been so many times, right, like when I shot my bull last year, he stepped out and I, I shot him, there was a cow like under 10 yards right to the left of me. Just over a rise. I could see like her ears if I were to call and stop that bull or try to get him to come out like that, cow's just gonna pick up her head and see me. I'm pretty [00:32:00] much in the wide open at 10 yards. Like it's gonna be game over. They've been with the same elk all night. They know what elk are around. All of a sudden you throw in a different cow call like. In the, the kitchen of all these elk and they're like, whoa, what? Like, who, where, where's this coming from? What's going on here? Oft like, obviously there's times where I've gotten away with it and I have called in bulls in that country, but, uh, wildly more oftentimes than not, let 'em talk, get slip in there and, you know, get an arrow or, you know, rifle if you can. Obviously makes it a little bit easier because you don't have to get in that, you know, 50 ish yards or, or in, um, but yeah, let 'em talk and, and slip in undetected is, is kind of how I've been doing it recently. More in open terrain. [00:32:43] Travis Bader: Hmm. So I'll be, I've got a northern British Columbia elk hunt. I'll be on that for a couple weeks or going up early and then going into the rut. Uh, I get back from that. I'll be up to Alaska. There's a, uh, it'll be my first time in Alaska. Never been there before, so I'm [00:33:00] looking forward to that. Awesome. A friend of mine. A friend of mine, she's, uh, big in the fishing world, April Vokey. She says, I got this thing going on over in, uh, uh, this company called Chrome Chasers, and you should come on over and let's, let's do something together. So we'll be, we'll be there for a week. Her and her family. And me and my family. And then, uh, I've got another elk hunt in Alberta. I've never hunted in Alberta before, but this is gonna be your more open planes type thing. So, uh, I'm observing what I can from you, from your experience and, um, I've got a lot of research to do before I jump into that one. So that'll be, uh, that'll be fun. How about you? What kind of, what kind of plans you gotta, uh, lined up for this season? [00:33:40] Dylan Dowson: It's, it's gonna be a busy fall. The, the draws were good to us this year, thankfully. Um. So I'm gonna kick it off. Uh, plans are a little bit up in the air right now, but I'm gonna kick it off with a Wyoming elk hunt. So, as I was just saying, you know, I typically archery hunt elk with, uh, you know, I, I just archery hunt elk if, unless I'm trying to [00:34:00] fill the freezer with a, a cow or something. Late season Wyoming this year. The plan right now anyways, is to take a rifle. Um, I might still take a bow depending on, and then hit like the last few days of archery and then be there for rifle opener. But that one's gonna be a horseback style hunt. Um, kind of a, a wilderness back country. Like, really, really cool. It's been a while. You know, I, I usually do a horse hunt every year, every other year or something. I unfortunately have some friends with some horses and, uh, it's kinda like a boat, you know, that saying, it's like the be, you know, the only thing better than owning horses is having a friend who owns horses. Yep. So, anyways, I, uh, I've done a little bit of it, but not necessarily a. Hey, we're going deep in the back country for 10 days and we're, we're taking a horse string type type of hunt. So I'm excited for that one to kick it off. Um, and then actually after I rifle hunt Wyoming, I'm gonna come back and archery hunt Montana. It'll be kind of a later season hunt into [00:35:00] October. Um, but I found some success, you know, there when a lot of folks come third week of September, second week of September, and, you know, hunt it out and there's a lot of competition. And then after, after that, a lot of folks go home and it's kind of nice to have less, less competition in the woods. Uh, and some, some bulls still fired up late season. So come back in. Archery hunt Montana, uh, followed up with a rifle, mul deer and rifle antelope punt. I drew my antelope permit this year in Montana. And then, uh, my wife, this is kind of the, I've got a lot of hunts this year, but this is the one I'm most excited for. My wife drew one of Montana's hardest to get. Rifle bull elk tags, and she's never shot an elk before. Um, wow. Yeah. And it's, I mean, it's a, it's a heck of a unit. I'm gonna go put some boots on the ground, uh, this weekend actually, and, and scout it, learn it a little bit better, but just the, the trophy potential in there is pretty, pretty crazy. And she's never shot an elk before. [00:36:00] So super excited for, for that hunt, probably more than any of the other ones. And, and just, uh, help her, you know, hopefully shoot her first bull. And I, I hope I told, I keep telling her, I hope it's bigger than any bull I've killed, um, for her first one. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. So that's, that's kind of my goal. But, uh, we'll see. It'll be a blast no matter what. A little bit challenging, because we didn't, didn't really expect her to draw this tag. It's so hard to get. And we have a four and a 2-year-old at home, so we're a gonna be hunting and b gonna be, you know. Having babysitters hang out with them and grandparents are gonna be involved. And um, but the goal, what I would love is for them to be at least in camp when she shoots a bull so they can come, you know, experience that. Um, and we did that last year with some antelope and they were there kind of along for it and got to experience it. And, uh, just to see them like, you know, we, we went fishing this past weekend, for example, and then we ate, ate some fish two nights [00:37:00] ago. And, and to see that connection, right, of like, oh, here's what we're doing. And now we're eating it, and this is awesome. Mm-hmm. Uh, my 4-year-old, you know, he'll we'll be eating steak and he just knows now at this point, if we're eating burger steak, it's elk and we will be eating steak. And he is like, dad, which, which bull is this? You know? And then he wants me to like point to which one it is that, that we are eating and and whatnot. And so that's super cool, uh, to see, and especially from an early age. And so, yeah. Long-winded way of saying I'm, I hope at least that they're in camp, um, or can be close when, when she does, uh, shoot her first elk. [00:37:35] Travis Bader: I think that's a really important piece of the puzzle. I think, uh, people in general are fairly disconnected from their food and however you can bridge that gap, whether that's gardening in the backyard or going to the farm market, um, seeing the process of where food lives, if you're a meat eater and how it ends up on your table. And if you're a hunter, having the [00:38:00] kids involved with this. 'cause it creates such an appreciation, not just for the food, but also for life in general. And I find that death is such a closed door activity nowadays, that it creates a warped idea, uh, in a lot of people's minds. What they see is death. The closest thing they get is gonna be video games. And, uh, that's not really a healthy representation of, uh, of life and death. I, I think it's really important to be raising your kids and raising your family with that connection to nature. Have you, yeah. Done a lot of hunts with your wife and of course your kids being young, two and four, probably not a ton with them, but is hunting with a family a uh, a big thing you do? [00:38:43] Dylan Dowson: It is. Um, so my wife, when, when we first met, she had never shot a gun. Um, so actually the very first time we ever, you know, hung out, we went to, to the. The, the country and shot some guns and like that was kind of how we got to know each other. But, [00:39:00] uh, yeah, so it wasn't, she didn't grow up hunting or anything like that. But, uh, we've hunted deer for probably six or seven years now together. Um, she shot a lot of really nice bugs with me, a couple of antelope, um, hopefully a big bull elk this year. But, you know, we, we get out when we can and, and it is important and we, I really appreciate that time. A lot of the hunts I do too are like somewhat work related, and so they're outta state stuff. So I, I wouldn't say like we're hunting partners every time, but when we, when we can, we definitely make time to get out with each other and yeah, I'm excited for the, the boys to start coming with us and yeah, the, the antelope last year, for example, the boys, uh, were with my dad in the pickup and my wife and I went out and made a couple stocks, shot two nice bucks, and then they were able to come. Get pictures, you know, with us and the animals. And then also see like us breaking them down in the field and, and then putting that meat on [00:40:00] ice. And to me that was like very important for them to be there for that because, you know, like you said, not only the, the connection to death in your food, but it's like, here's the process and like, here's the work that goes into it. And it's really hot out right now and like, you know, you're, you're cutting up meat and getting it on ice and that's like, we value this a lot. And yes, it's really, it's fun to go hunting and it's fun to get that shot on a nice buck, but we, we really value, like taking care of the meat and then, you know, processing it ourselves if you can or whatever you, whatever you need to do there. Um, but then pulling it outta the freezer and being like, Hey, this is the animal animal buck that mom shot last year that you were with. Like, and that connection, like you can already just see, see the wheels turning in their minds, which is really, really important and, and cool to be able to do. [00:40:49] Travis Bader: It's funny, some of the similarities that I'm sensing here. So my wife as well had never shot a firearm prior to meeting me, and she came from a very [00:41:00] liberal left-leaning, uh, family and background. Uh, so much so, so her maiden name is Sinclair. Uh, she's directly related to Margaret Sinclair, who was, uh, Pierre Elliot, Trudeau's wife, Justin Trudeau's, uh, mother. There was always that sort of liberal sentiment in the family and to see where her upbringing was and where she is now. What, uh, the driver for her, she's a chef by trade, was that connection to the food and wanting just to be deeper connected to it. And, um, it's funny watching people who come from a very liberal background and, uh, opening up to what's more this redneck hunting, fish and sort of culture. Not in a redneck way. Yeah. And, and seeing how, seeing how that resonates with them and seeing how their lives change. And I can tell you without a doubt, my best hunts have always been with family, with, uh, my wife, with my kids. And, uh, there's something really [00:42:00] special about that when you're sitting down at the table and everyone, like, my son is this, is this from the deer that I shot last season going on and telling his sister about the adventure. I mean, there's, there's something to that. [00:42:12] Dylan Dowson: Yeah. No, it's, it's really cool. And, um, yeah, I feel very fortunate to be able to, you know, kind of tying it back into OnX in some sense, right? Like I, I've gotten to do a lot of really cool things because of the opportunities that I've been given through, through this job that I currently have and, and working in the industry. And, um, yeah, it's just expanded. Expanded what I personally have, have done or probably would've done. With my personal hunting, you know, Montana, there's a lot of things to do. There's a lot of, a lot of critters, a lot of seasons, and that's kind of where my mind was. And, uh, you brought up Alaska and I've been to Alaska twice and they were, you know, both kind of opportunities through my job, uh, to go explore and hunt Alaska. It was just amazing. Like the first one was Kodiak. [00:43:00] Uh, we hunted sick of Blacktail on Kodiak, just the, the coolest place probably I've ever been. Um, amazing. And then last year went up to Northern Alaska and, uh, I shot a, a caribou with my bow up there. And just another thing that, you know, I probably, I wouldn't say that I, I wouldn't have done it right, but it would just be a lot harder to do. Um, and it's less likely that I would get to go do those type of things without, uh, without some of the things. So yeah, I just feel super, super fortunate, uh, to be able to do those things and explore new areas from, you know, deer hunts in Colorado to Alaska. Uh. My wife, and actually this, this one definitely wasn't a work one, but my wife, and actually we got married, uh, it's just been a little over five years ago right in the, the peak of the, the COVID and, uh, pandemic. And, you know, we couldn't really travel anywhere for a honeymoon, right? Like it was hard to travel and go do [00:44:00] anything, uh, at that time. So we, we had our wedding and got married and kind of set aside a honeymoon fund in the, the gun stay for five years, and thankfully didn't touch it. Mm. This year we, we went to Hawaii and, uh, did our honeymoon on our five year anniversary, or close to our five year anniversary. And, um, I hunted access to deer down there. So it was, it was cool to tie in a, a morning of access to your hunting in a, a new area and, uh, be able to do that on quote. My honeymoon was pretty awesome. [00:44:30] Travis Bader: Nice. What island? [00:44:32] Dylan Dowson: Uh, we were on Maui. Okay. [00:44:35] Travis Bader: I, I hunted axis on Molokai. That was, uh, that's kind of a neat experience. They're everywhere. Yeah. And yeah, it's, I've never had a deer bark at me before, but that was kind of cool. [00:44:45] Dylan Dowson: Yeah. Yeah, it was, it was an experience for sure. I mean, we saw, shoot, we were a little early, earlier than the rut. Um, but we saw in one morning probably three, 400 deer. Crazy, I mean, a ton of deer, only a couple mature [00:45:00] bucks. Um, but yeah, it was just, it was cool, cool hunting and Yeah, I know not, not too many guys can stay on their honeymoon. They went hunting, so very fortunate on that end. A hundred percent. Can you tell me about scuba moose? Yes. You, uh, yeah. So Scuba moose, uh, that's, that's a whole podcast by itself there. That's, that's a pretty crazy, pretty crazy story. So this was, shoot, probably. Five, six years ago at this point, maybe a little longer even, uh, my dad called me and he said, well, he called me much earlier than this, but he called me and he said, Hey, I'm thinking about doing a archery moose hunt in British Columbia. And I was like, you've got my interest. What, uh mm-hmm. What's going on? And so him and a friend of his were, were talking about going up and, and doing this kind of once in a lifetime moose hunt. Um, and it was one of those things where I, [00:46:00] I didn't, you know, have the money to go do it myself, but I was like, 100% I'm coming with, uh, figure out what it would cost for me to come, you know, just as a, a non hunter in camp and, and be there and experience it. So I, I went up with him. Uh, we drove like 35 hours from Montana, hopped on a float plane, you know, just crazy stuff for us. Like I know some folks that live up there. That's just kind of what. What you do, right? But, uh, it's not what we do in Montana. We don't use float planes and, and get dropped off in the middle of nowhere like that. And it was just a really cool experience. And, uh, again, this could be a two hour long conversation with this, this hunt in particular, but essentially had an amazing hunt. Uh, the hunting was relatively slow for the first four or five days weather started to come in. Um, and this was an archery, archery moose hunt. And the lakes were starting to freeze up a little bit and then they would thaw during the day. Fast forward a couple days and [00:47:00] we, we saw and called in just like an absolute giant bull. Um, I don't know. I mean, I've been around some SHIs moose in Montana and whatnot. You know, you know, you, you watch videos and whatnot. You know what a, a big bull is just like any animal. Mm-hmm. But it was like one of those bulls that you didn't have to know a single thing about moose to know like, holy cows, this thing is giant. Um, and so, yeah, I was standing right next to my dad when this bull came across in front of us, like 40 yards. And, uh, he drew and the bull, the bull stopped like kind of quartering to us. And, um, I videoed this whole thing, you know, just on like a, a crappy little handycam and whatnot and put together a, uh, a video on it. But, uh, yeah, the bull stopped quartering to, and my dad was at full draw and like I whispered his ear like, don't shoot. Like that shoulder was just right there and it would've been a pretty risky shot. And, uh, he obviously was thinking the same thing. And when that bull went to leave, he turned, [00:48:00] my dad shot, got narrow in him, and he drew his bow again. And, and I stopped that bull as he was kind of going outta sight. He shot again. Got a second arrow in him. Um, and uh, yeah, that bull went around embedded and there's, there's so many pieces to this story that kind of made it all like a really unique scenario. But keep in mind that the lakes were freezing over. That's a key part. So this bull goes over in, in beds and another bull. We accidentally called in another bull and it came and got him out of his bed, bumped him up, and we watched him go in the timber. And we could tell like this, it was a fatal shot, like you could tell for sure, but it might take a little bit of time. So we're, we had some discussions. It's like, should we back out? Should we wait? You know, should we wait till dark and then go try and recover him? And we unanimously decide like, let's just back out. That bull's gonna be there. We'll come in right away. First thing in the morning that bull's gonna be there. Let's not push him. Um. [00:49:00] Let's, let's do the right thing here. So we hiked all the way back out, went to go get picked up, and uh, the main guy picked us up. We told him about, you know, the, this crazy bull and this crazy, you know, what just happened. And he was excited. And then the look on his face just changed and we're like, what's, what's the matter? And he was like, the float plane called and they have to pick us up tomorrow morning. We have a crazy weather system coming in. And they're worried that like, if they don't get their hunters out tomorrow morning, like now that they're, we're gonna be stuck here. Hmm. That changed things from, like, we were, you know, pretty high spirits of like that bull, you know, there's a good chance that bull probably is already dead, um, laying in his bed. But we're not gonna push it. We're gonna just find him first thing in the morning to looking at the clock. And we're like, we've got like 45 minutes until it's dark. Let's go recover that bull now. Um, because we have to get him cut up because we have to leave. First thing tomorrow morning. So we basically ran all the way back there, picked up the blood, it was great blood, [00:50:00] found the arrow, uh, we're tracking that bull through the timber and he, he was almost expired, jumped out of his bed. We bumped him and he ran straight into the water. [00:50:10] Travis Bader: Ah, [00:50:11] Dylan Dowson: and the whole time, like the guides were telling us like if a moose gets hit and he, he runs into the water. Like it's, it's okay. Like it happens. They've recovered several moose from the lakes before. Go get inflate, uh, a raft if you need to get it shore. Cut it up like it happens. Not a big deal. Well this bull went out there and, uh, and he died and sunk and did not resurface. And we were standing there looking right where we had last seen him and just waiting, you know, and waiting and waiting and finally pulling out our headlamps and stuff and looking and no moose. And, you know, we just, it was kind of a weird. How everything happened was just a crazy set of circumstances, but we were just waiting for this moose to float, and he never did. Well, it got so dark that we were like, we don't, there's nothing we [00:51:00] can do. The water was basically freezing. So at one point I was like, what if we built a fire and I swam out there and tried to, you know, find him and wrap something around his paddle or whatever, right. Just all, all options around the table. Mm-hmm. And the guide right away was like, yeah, that's absolutely not happening. Like even if we build a big fire, like there's hypothermia and, you know, risk of whatever. So anyways, we, we hike back, go back to the, the cabin and essentially we devised a plan that the next morning the float plane would show up. We would hop in it, we would fly over to that lake where the moose was in. He would be floating because Moose float and recover him and start working him up while they start shuttling the other folks in gear out. And so we were still like, all right, well that's, you know, that's what's gonna happen. And again, the set of circumstances like that, the float plane ended up not showing up until like 4:00 PM the next afternoon. [00:51:58] Travis Bader: Mm. [00:51:58] Dylan Dowson: Because of [00:52:00] some other things that went wrong. And so hindsight, we could have left him, but, you know, it's just you, you don't know, and you, you mm-hmm. Play the, the hand that you're dealt. And essentially when they showed up, we, we flew the other lake and we did everything that we could. Um, and there he still hadn't floated. There was, there was nothing there we couldn't see through the water. There was just no signs of this moose. And essentially the, the pilot was like, you guys are, you guys are leaving. You don't have a choice. We have to get you out of here right now. So we essentially did everything we could and, and we're forced to leave. Um, and yeah, it was just incredibly disheartening when we left, you know, all of our gear loaded behind us. We flew right over that lake and between frantically searching for any sign of, of that moose and knowing what had happened and where he was, it was just like, you know, just the, the craziest feeling ever of super hard hunt once in a lifetime hunt for us. No moose sightings to like the biggest bull that we will probably ever see in our lifetime at 40 yards to [00:53:00] that happening. And now we're going home and there's nothing we can do about it, you know, it's out of our hands. So, um, essentially some, some phone calls were made and we were like, Hey, we, we realized it's incredibly bittersweet because that, that meat is, is no longer ours, even if we recover this bull. But, uh, we, my dad wanted to go up and, and give it one more shot to try and find him right, to just kind of more putting, put an end to the, the story of, you know, we did every possible thing we could to recover that moose. And so I think it was July, June or July when the ice came off, uh, and we headed up north, hop back in a float plane, another 35 hour drive up there, hop back in a float plane Wow. With, uh, all sorts of camping gear with, uh, chains, ropes, pulleys, whatever we could to poss, you know, we had an entire winter to think about how we could recover this moose if he is still at the bottom of the lake. Um, and we flew in there with enough camping gear for three or four days and, which honestly like, [00:54:00] obviously I wish we would've just recovered that bull when, when he had shot him. But it was also really, it was cool to go back into that country because I left that following or the previous fall being like, I'll never be back here. Like, what are the chance that I will ever step foot in this country again? And it was almost like one of those things where you're sad leaving. Uh, so it was cool to go back into that same country. Um, obviously I wish it was under different circumstances, but, uh, we. We got to the lake and we buzzed a couple times with the plane and didn't see anything, didn't see anything. And uh, we were about to get dropped off and the pilot switched directions on which way he was flying the lake. And we flew around the other way. And I still, still remember I had a headset on and the pilot did, but my dad and the, the guy that came back in with us did not. And so I was talking to the pilot and he was like, I think I see something. And he turned around and went a little bit lower and banked the plane really hard. And he's like, I got him. He is like, that is, that's the bull. He's red on the shore, [00:55:00] like absolute giant. Like I see him and I remember I asked him like five times, I was like, are you sure? This is like, that's my dad's bull. Because I didn't want to tell my dad like, Hey, we got him. You know? 'cause he couldn't hear our conversation. [00:55:13] Travis Bader: Mm-hmm. [00:55:13] Dylan Dowson: I didn't wanna tell him we got him if it, if it wasn't or if it was just a different deadhead or something. Right. And so he is like, there's no way. That's not that bull. It's like one of the biggest moose I've seen. Around here and I can tell from the plane, so I, I tapped him on the shoulder again with thumbs up and, you know, it's so loud in those, those beavers that you can't really hear each other. But yeah, uh, yeah, it was just a really cool moment and we, we landed and, uh, recovered him and, uh, all the bones, what we had, basically what we had determined was at some point, uh, I don't know if it took a while for the ice to actually get up there or what happened. I don't know if a, a grizzly, like if he floated and a grizzly went out and got him and drug him to shore or if he floated and pushed to shore. But that entire embankment around where that moose was, was dug out and there was bear sign everywhere. [00:56:00] So at some point, whether it be that, that spring or the winter before hibernation, uh, a bear had been on that moose and you know, had completely dug out the bank. 'cause I had video and photos from the air of what that bank looked like before and then after when we got there, and it was just like. A grizzly just lived on top of that moose essentially. Um, so yeah, it was a bunch of bones in the water and, and, uh, you know, the skull and, and that moose was, he was in perfect shape and brought him back home and cleaned him up. And now he is, he's in my, my dad's shop. Um, which again, it wasn't necessarily going back for the trophy aspect of it, right. It was more just like we knew he was right there. There's nothing we could do. Like we can go back and try to recover him to, to kind of close the, the story, if you will. And it was more a, a sense of, uh, accomplishment for us to go back and do it. Then it was like, oh, it's a really big bull, so we gotta go back and get him right. It was, uh, it was much more fulfilling just to [00:57:00] like, we did everything we could and, and finally we, we recovered him. So it was a, it was a pretty, pretty crazy, you know, from the time he shot that bull till we recovered him was like five months or so. Um, and yeah, just a, just a crazy orde. [00:57:17] Travis Bader: What a heck of an emotional roller coaster. That's, uh, yeah, it was, so I think you flew with Nick ha's company outta Burns Lake there, which is, uh, lake District. I think that was the, uh, the company you flew with. [00:57:30] Dylan Dowson: It might have been. We, yeah, it was, uh, Des Lake. [00:57:34] Travis Bader: It was it Des Lake? [00:57:36] Dylan Dowson: Yeah. [00:57:36] Travis Bader: Okay. I I, I saw a little clip I saw on the back of the playing the LD on there. But you know, those Bush pilots, they're, they're built a little different. Yes. And, uh, if they say it's time to come out, you kinda have to listen to 'em because their threshold for comfort probably exceeds your threshold for comfort when you're out there. Yeah. I remember, um, Nick was, [00:58:00] uh, flying us to. Uh, during the, um, the hunting season, he'll fly people into different guide outfitters areas and he set up some cabins on a few lakes and he is got an agreement and he says, look it, I don't fly people in for hunting unless they're coming for you. But, you know, summertime fishing, I got my fishing lodges and people can, can use 'em and rent 'em. So anyways, went up there with my family, did a, uh, a fishing trip on one of these, uh, one of the lakes where he is got a cabin set up and we're flying out there. And he's talking about, he says, you know, I don't mean to scare you Trav, but man, these things break all the time. 'cause I was asking where his other plane was, right? We're flying in on a beaver. He had a 180, uh, Cessna. And he's like, these things break all the time. He is going to all the problems and issues that the planes have and he's taking pictures as we fly in. It was about an hour flight that we took him. And, uh, I'm like, what are you doing? He said, well, you know, that other guy at the, uh, that I had at the docks area, he is helping load. He's a [00:59:00] pilot, he's a helicopter pilot, and, uh, he also flies fixed wing and commercially, and he's just coming on board to help me out. Oh, okay. So I'm just taking pictures of the weather patterns so that he's got a better idea of what this looks like. 'cause he's used to these short runs. This longer run is you gotta start making decisions as do we turn around or not? Right? Anyways, uh, he's going on and he is talking about stuff and I'm looking like I'm not really seeing anything that looks too terrible. Uh, I think most of their flying's gonna be VFR visual flight rules. And, uh, every once in a while you end up getting clouded out a bit. And so your IFR, but, uh, he says, we're gonna come around this bank, we're gonna see it's our final approach and it's our very last decision making time if we hit the lake or not. And this is after about an hour flying and we're just about ready to land. And I thought he was joking, just given, 'cause I, I'm looking, it looks fine enough anyways. He goes in, he says, okay, we're doing it. Lands a plane. I'm like, I I don't get why [01:00:00] he's acting like this. We run in, we get the spikes off the, uh, the door of the cabin 'cause he is got these, uh. Uh, plywood with spikes coming up to keep the bears out, right? And get the boards off the windows. He says, okay, you're good starting the fridge. You're good with the stuff and, uh, see ya. We're out. Right? And so he's gone. Fair enough. We spend the, um, uh, a week out there. All of our, uh, all of our fresh food didn't really stay fresh because his fridge didn't work. And, um, uh, so thankfully we were able to catch lots of fish and that was our fresh food. He comes back in and I'm asking him about his, uh, his buddy. He says, oh, well, how's your buddy doing? I, I thought maybe he'd be flying out. He says, nah, he quit. What do you mean he quit? He said, I showed him these pictures that I took and, uh, that was it. And he says, I can't, I don't have the stomach for this. Oh, okay. So, um, then, then I sit in the plane and the chair, the seat breaks, and I, I'm like, [01:01:00] I'm okay. That's fine. I could do an ab crunch when we go up. He's like, Nope, if that chair, if your seat isn't secured in properly, we're not taken off safety first. I go, okay, fine. And gets his leatherman out and he turns this screw like a little half turn and just kind of catching onto the back of my seat. He's like, there we go. Now we're safe. I'm like, all right. So I'm doing the crotch anyways, right? We, we take on off and man, he is great guy. Uh, very competent pilot. My, uh, uh, wife and son and daughter and dog are in the back of this beaver, and I'm the passenger up front because he got a little bit more leg room. They're all crammed in the back. He's got the plane on the side and he's pointing out different, uh, sheep and different, uh, terrain and. Uh, my son, uh, he was training to be, become a pilot since an early age. So I think at that age he was about 13 or 14. And so he's cool as a cucumber. This is all new, this, he's all used to it. And my daughter and uh, wife are back there and they see the light come on, on [01:02:00] the, uh, the plane and this thing start flashing and my wife's tapping me on the back shoulder and he's pointing out the window looking at stuff and all of a sudden we run out of fuel and, uh, ooh. But it, but it's got two tanks, right? We, we got enough room that we could float down if we needed to glide down to a lake. And so he's madly pumping the thing and writing it up. But I guess all of this is to say that their comfort level for adventure and risk is pretty high if they've made a living outta flying people into the back country. So if they've. Call in and say, we have to get you out. I'm gonna listen to them because Yeah. Probably have to leave. [01:02:41] Dylan Dowson: Yeah. Yeah. It was, it was just such a cool experience and, uh, yeah, just being in that plane, it was like, again, it's not what we do in Montana and [01:02:50] Travis Bader: Mm, [01:02:52] Dylan Dowson: yes people have used planes to access country and whatnot, but that part was, uh, I wouldn't say as cool as the hunt [01:03:00] itself, but it was just like a part of the experience. Right. And like, talking to those pilots, um, heard some crazy stories 'cause we were, you know, a little over an hour flight probably too. And one way, and, and yeah, just having conversations and learning about their life and how they became to be a Bush pilot, uh, is pretty cool. And, uh, I don't know how much truth there is to this, but there's probably some, uh, Pete, one of the, the main guy with us was telling us, you know, about all of his flight stories over the years and, and situations and stuff. And he is like, yeah, you don't judge. Uh. What do you say? Something about how you don't judge a pilot by how many times if he's crashed or not. You judge a, a good bush pilot by how many times he's crashed and lived, and I was like, mm-hmm. Oh, that's a, that's a kind of an eye-opening statement of like, oh yeah, that guy's crashed a few planes, but he lives, he's like, he's still flying. He is doing good. Uh, which is a kind of a crazy, crazy ordeal, but, uh, yeah, just a different, different way of transport up there and it's, it was pretty cool. [01:04:00] That [01:04:00] Travis Bader: is neat. Is there anything that we should be talking about that we haven't talked about? [01:04:05] Dylan Dowson: I don't think so. Um, yeah, I mean, I guess to, to kind of bring full circle to the OnX side of things, but, uh, on X is in Canada now. Download it, try it free. Uh, if, if you haven't already, and, and, uh, put it to use on your hunts. Let us know what you think of it. And specifically with Canada, if there's anything that, you know, we feel that you guys feel that, uh, we should add, um, or different, let us know. We, we love. Listening to customer's feedback and, you know, I've got limited experience hunting in Canada that the story I just told. And, um, I hunted some black bears in Saskatchewan last year, um, actually earlier this spring. But, uh, yeah, we want to hear from the folks that are out there using it, like what is, what's helpful, what's not, uh, what would you like to see in the product? But, uh, yeah, I mean the biggest thing again on XY is just download it for free, try it, and uh, hopefully it's one of those tools that helps you, you know, go more places, explore new country and, and find more [01:05:00] success. Really [01:05:01] Travis Bader: amazing. Dylan, thank you very much for being on this Silver Corp podcast. [01:05:06] Dylan Dowson: Yeah, thank you for having me.